Original Posted By: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
for sparI'd heard word-of-mouth at SNF that the recommended scarfing slope in AC 43-13(Chapter 1, somewhere around page 15) had increased to 15 to 1. I don't rememberwhat it used to be, or if that was a line just to sucker me in, but you mightwant to check it out just in case.Jim Ash-----Original Message----->From: John Franklin >Sent: May 31, 2012 4:43 PM>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar>>>My spars were built as an I-beam design with 3/8" ply sandwiched between 5/16"x 1" Douglas fir strips. The scarf joints, following the 15:1 rule, were about6" in length and were laminated with 1/8" ply. A 6" scarf is a pain in thearse to fit properly. Disclaimer here, I haven't flown these wings yet!>>John Franklin>Prairie Aire 4TA0>GN-1 / Corvair>>>-----Original Message----->>From: nightmare >>Sent: May 31, 2012 2:19 PM>>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>>Subject: Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar>>>>>>have seen 2 different ways of making a scarf joint. joint is made along the face,or the edge. I know 43-13 probably explains it, but I dont have a copy yet.which way is acceptable for a spar. I plan on 3/4 stock with 1/8 inch laminationon each side. Sorry if this is obvious by looking at plans too, but donthave those yet either. curiosity has gotten the best of me. thanks; Paul>>>>>>>>>>Read this topic online here:>>>>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar
Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar
Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: "nightmare"
Mike and Jack,Yes, I still have "the mount that Jack built"! It worked great (not flying yet)and I seem to recall 9/16" offset, but I would have to double check when I gethome. BTW, Jack's mount is available to pass along to anyone interested (hesaid it was OK, and I know he likes Spotted Cow in Brodhead!). I'm in SouthernMaryland if interested, feel free to contact me offline; chase143(at)aol.com.Steve--------Stevewww.mypiet.comRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar
Mike and Jack,Yes, I still have "the mount that Jack built"! It worked great (not flying yet)and I seem to recall 9/16" offset, but I would have to double check when I gethome. BTW, Jack's mount is available to pass along to anyone interested (hesaid it was OK, and I know he likes Spotted Cow in Brodhead!). I'm in SouthernMaryland if interested, feel free to contact me offline; chase143(at)aol.com.Steve--------Stevewww.mypiet.comRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar
Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: "nightmare"
have seen 2 different ways of making a scarf joint. joint is made along the face,or the edge. I know 43-13 probably explains it, but I dont have a copy yet.which way is acceptable for a spar. I plan on 3/4 stock with 1/8 inch laminationon each side. Sorry if this is obvious by looking at plans too, but dont havethose yet either. curiosity has gotten the best of me. thanks; PaulRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
have seen 2 different ways of making a scarf joint. joint is made along the face,or the edge. I know 43-13 probably explains it, but I dont have a copy yet.which way is acceptable for a spar. I plan on 3/4 stock with 1/8 inch laminationon each side. Sorry if this is obvious by looking at plans too, but dont havethose yet either. curiosity has gotten the best of me. thanks; PaulRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: Joe Street
looks like i found my answer on an online 43-13. well anywho, has anyone madea scarf joint on a spar? any laminations over it? thanks; PaulRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Thu, 31 May 2012 16:21:30 -0400
looks like i found my answer on an online 43-13. well anywho, has anyone madea scarf joint on a spar? any laminations over it? thanks; PaulRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Thu, 31 May 2012 16:21:30 -0400
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: John Franklin
I used a laminated spar with scarfs. Pictures here http://textors.com/PietProject.html Jack TextorSent from my iPadOn May 31, 2012, at 2:32 PM, "nightmare" wrote:> > looks like i found my answer on an online 43-13. well anywho, has anyone madea scarf joint on a spar? any laminations over it? thanks; Paul> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 414#374414> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 31 May 2012 15:43:34 -0500 (GMT-05:00)
I used a laminated spar with scarfs. Pictures here http://textors.com/PietProject.html Jack TextorSent from my iPadOn May 31, 2012, at 2:32 PM, "nightmare" wrote:> > looks like i found my answer on an online 43-13. well anywho, has anyone madea scarf joint on a spar? any laminations over it? thanks; Paul> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 414#374414> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 31 May 2012 15:43:34 -0500 (GMT-05:00)
> Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: Jim Ash
Re: Pietenpol-List: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: Jim Ash
Always been 15 to 1.GarySent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry-----Original Message-----
Always been 15 to 1.GarySent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: "nightmare"
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Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
sensing a bit of sarcasm Ryan. my question "have seen 2 different ways of makinga scarf joint. joint is made along the face, or the edge. which way is acceptablefor a spar?" I did find the answer for that in chapter 1 section 40 figure4 (not section 4). I then put out a statement about how I plan on buildingmy spar. Since this is probably the most critical part of a homebuilt aircraft, and there is obviously several different ways of making a spar, and since43-13 is "the bible" and we know the bible is never misinterpreted, I figuredthis being a forum, it would be nice to hear from the folks who have actuallybuilt , flown and know others who have done the same. Based on the responses andsome questioning of the "bible", I'm glad I brought up the subject. forgiveme if I incorrectly sensed your sarcasm. haven't had my coffee yet. Thanks to the others for your responses, great pics Jack. PaulRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 05:12:51 -0500Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
sensing a bit of sarcasm Ryan. my question "have seen 2 different ways of makinga scarf joint. joint is made along the face, or the edge. which way is acceptablefor a spar?" I did find the answer for that in chapter 1 section 40 figure4 (not section 4). I then put out a statement about how I plan on buildingmy spar. Since this is probably the most critical part of a homebuilt aircraft, and there is obviously several different ways of making a spar, and since43-13 is "the bible" and we know the bible is never misinterpreted, I figuredthis being a forum, it would be nice to hear from the folks who have actuallybuilt , flown and know others who have done the same. Based on the responses andsome questioning of the "bible", I'm glad I brought up the subject. forgiveme if I incorrectly sensed your sarcasm. haven't had my coffee yet. Thanks to the others for your responses, great pics Jack. PaulRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 05:12:51 -0500Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
Pietenpol-List: Re: Fun Pietenpol video
Original Posted By: "aerocarjake"
Getting back to the original question, Paul, it's funny that you should be askingthis question, even thought you do not have a set of plans, because the Pietenpolplans show a method of spar splicing that is NOT recommended (see attachedclip from the plans). Probably all of the early Pietenpol aircraft used thismethod, and I don't think that they fell from the skies as a result, but itis not a very strong method of splicing.As it happens, the bulk of the heavy lifting is performed by the lift struts. The3 piece wing has a 3 piece spar, held together with a few bolts, but actuallyfree to pivot (if the lift struts weren't there)Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dwg_ ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fun Pietenpol video
Getting back to the original question, Paul, it's funny that you should be askingthis question, even thought you do not have a set of plans, because the Pietenpolplans show a method of spar splicing that is NOT recommended (see attachedclip from the plans). Probably all of the early Pietenpol aircraft used thismethod, and I don't think that they fell from the skies as a result, but itis not a very strong method of splicing.As it happens, the bulk of the heavy lifting is performed by the lift struts. The3 piece wing has a 3 piece spar, held together with a few bolts, but actuallyfree to pivot (if the lift struts weren't there)Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dwg_ ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fun Pietenpol video
Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
Original Posted By: "nightmare"
Sorry for the delay=2C but whoever asked about the Hegy prop=2C I sold it some time ago. Regretted it later =3Bo)Regarding washers=2C engine offset=2C and fin offset: Scout has about 1/2" offset on the leading edge of the vertical stab and that's all I felt comfortable cranking in because it looked like it would stress the glue joints in the wood. It could use some more offset. The trailing edge remains fixed while the leading edge is pulled over=2C and I didn't want to go with anymore. It turned out well because I needed to offset the fin enough to where I had new material to screw the mounting tabs into anyway. If you build it with offset from the start=2C that would be best. Scout still needs a small bendable trim tab on the rudder as well as some washers on the engine mount to improve the yaw in cruise. It flies just about like the others say theirs do (mine has an A75)- about a half a ball out. Almost=2C but not quite=2C feet flat on the floor in cruise=2C but a good pilot's feet are never on the floor anyway.By the way=2C I do not recommend the use of standard large AN flat washers for the engine offset duty. They are too thin and become dished. I ordered a pack of nice thick black oxide-finished steel washers from McMaster-Carr and they are perfect. I believe they are the 92140A series washers=2C about a buck apiece in that size. I think Aircraft Spruce offers engine mount washers but they are more expensive than the McMaster-Carr items. I bought a bag of 10.Oscar ZunigaAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket"Medford=2C ORwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar
Sorry for the delay=2C but whoever asked about the Hegy prop=2C I sold it some time ago. Regretted it later =3Bo)Regarding washers=2C engine offset=2C and fin offset: Scout has about 1/2" offset on the leading edge of the vertical stab and that's all I felt comfortable cranking in because it looked like it would stress the glue joints in the wood. It could use some more offset. The trailing edge remains fixed while the leading edge is pulled over=2C and I didn't want to go with anymore. It turned out well because I needed to offset the fin enough to where I had new material to screw the mounting tabs into anyway. If you build it with offset from the start=2C that would be best. Scout still needs a small bendable trim tab on the rudder as well as some washers on the engine mount to improve the yaw in cruise. It flies just about like the others say theirs do (mine has an A75)- about a half a ball out. Almost=2C but not quite=2C feet flat on the floor in cruise=2C but a good pilot's feet are never on the floor anyway.By the way=2C I do not recommend the use of standard large AN flat washers for the engine offset duty. They are too thin and become dished. I ordered a pack of nice thick black oxide-finished steel washers from McMaster-Carr and they are perfect. I believe they are the 92140A series washers=2C about a buck apiece in that size. I think Aircraft Spruce offers engine mount washers but they are more expensive than the McMaster-Carr items. I bought a bag of 10.Oscar ZunigaAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket"Medford=2C ORwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: scarf joint for spar