Original Posted By: Mike Lund
Then answer this question for me why are Louisville sluggersMADE OF ASH and why did Mr., Pietenpol have ash installedin the floor at the most critical attachment point (struts) if ASHcan't take loads. My personal opinion is that shock resistance of ASH issuperior to other woods with maybe the exception of maple, this is whendimensioned the same. russell----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
> Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: "Doug"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve>>>>Steve W GN-1 builder>>IHA #6>>>Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells the rib>sets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.>>Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )>>________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve>>>>Steve W GN-1 builder>>IHA #6>>>Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells the rib>sets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.>>Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )>>________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: "Michael Brusilow"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? I remembersomeone mentioning it and I have found some locally. The local 'Homequarters"? I think had a stack of fence material so I saunterd over andread the shipping tag. Guess what its western red ceder much to mysurprise. I had called them some time ago asking them if they had this kind of woodand the Manager himself told me they dont have any such wood like that. Iimmediately found him and led him to his own stock. Wonder whare he washired from.SteveSteve W GN-1 builderIHA #6________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? I remembersomeone mentioning it and I have found some locally. The local 'Homequarters"? I think had a stack of fence material so I saunterd over andread the shipping tag. Guess what its western red ceder much to mysurprise. I had called them some time ago asking them if they had this kind of woodand the Manager himself told me they dont have any such wood like that. Iimmediately found him and led him to his own stock. Wonder whare he washired from.SteveSteve W GN-1 builderIHA #6________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: "Mike Lund"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve>>Steve W GN-1 builder>IHA #6Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells the ribsets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve>>Steve W GN-1 builder>IHA #6Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells the ribsets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: Michael Brusilow
The load on a single rib in most low-speed light airplanes is so low theycould probably be made of cardboard and still work OK...oh, wait a minute,Molt Talyer did that already...The main problems in selecting material is the flexability and "flex"resistance. I once saw some beutiful ribs made of 1/ 16" square ash. youcould stand on them and the would take the load as long as it was appliedGENTLY. as soon as the were "shock loaded" about 20% of a gentle load theyshattered.BTW--the tail bows on the flybaby are SPECED for laminated fence post ceder.Mike-----Original Message-----
The load on a single rib in most low-speed light airplanes is so low theycould probably be made of cardboard and still work OK...oh, wait a minute,Molt Talyer did that already...The main problems in selecting material is the flexability and "flex"resistance. I once saw some beutiful ribs made of 1/ 16" square ash. youcould stand on them and the would take the load as long as it was appliedGENTLY. as soon as the were "shock loaded" about 20% of a gentle load theyshattered.BTW--the tail bows on the flybaby are SPECED for laminated fence post ceder.Mike-----Original Message-----
>> Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By:>>> Michael Brusilow
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>Ash takes loads just fine (in fact, my next airplane project is gonna have>3/4" square ash longerons) but it is heavy and has a relatively low shock>resistance (still higher than spruce though). It also tends to>splinter/shatter instead of breaking clean (look at a broken bat to get the>idea)>>Remember, these ribs were 1/16" square to get roughly the same weight as>spruce ribs (I dont remember which planethey were for-- it was just a "can>it be done" type stunt) which I suspect is why they broke when "mistreated">>as a general rule ash is 8-10 times stronger than sitka BUT you can'treduce>the sizes by a factor of 8-10. You said it exactly right, when dimesioned>the same (or a hair smaller)>>Mike>-----Original Message----->From: kyle ray >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >Date: Thursday, December 30, 1999 3:26 PM>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>>Then answer this question for me why are Louisville sluggers>>MADE OF ASH and why did Mr., Pietenpol have ash installed>>in the floor at the most critical attachment point (struts) if ASH>>can't take loads. My personal opinion is that shock resistance of ASH is>>superior to other woods with maybe the exception of maple, this is when>>dimensioned the same.>>>> russell>>>>>>----- Original Message ----->>From: Mike Lund >>To: >>Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 7:09 PM>>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>>>>>> The load on a single rib in most low-speed light airplanes is so lowthey>>> could probably be made of cardboard and still work OK...oh, wait a>minute,>>> Molt Talyer did that already...>>>>>> The main problems in selecting material is the flexability and "flex">>> resistance. I once saw some beutiful ribs made of 1/ 16" square ash. you>>> could stand on them and the would take the load as long as it wasapplied>>> GENTLY. as soon as the were "shock loaded" about 20% of a gentle load>they>>> shattered.>>>>>> BTW--the tail bows on the flybaby are SPECED for laminated fence post>>ceder.>>>>>> Mike>>> -----Original Message-----
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>Ash takes loads just fine (in fact, my next airplane project is gonna have>3/4" square ash longerons) but it is heavy and has a relatively low shock>resistance (still higher than spruce though). It also tends to>splinter/shatter instead of breaking clean (look at a broken bat to get the>idea)>>Remember, these ribs were 1/16" square to get roughly the same weight as>spruce ribs (I dont remember which planethey were for-- it was just a "can>it be done" type stunt) which I suspect is why they broke when "mistreated">>as a general rule ash is 8-10 times stronger than sitka BUT you can'treduce>the sizes by a factor of 8-10. You said it exactly right, when dimesioned>the same (or a hair smaller)>>Mike>-----Original Message----->From: kyle ray >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >Date: Thursday, December 30, 1999 3:26 PM>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>>Then answer this question for me why are Louisville sluggers>>MADE OF ASH and why did Mr., Pietenpol have ash installed>>in the floor at the most critical attachment point (struts) if ASH>>can't take loads. My personal opinion is that shock resistance of ASH is>>superior to other woods with maybe the exception of maple, this is when>>dimensioned the same.>>>> russell>>>>>>----- Original Message ----->>From: Mike Lund >>To: >>Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 7:09 PM>>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>>>>>> The load on a single rib in most low-speed light airplanes is so lowthey>>> could probably be made of cardboard and still work OK...oh, wait a>minute,>>> Molt Talyer did that already...>>>>>> The main problems in selecting material is the flexability and "flex">>> resistance. I once saw some beutiful ribs made of 1/ 16" square ash. you>>> could stand on them and the would take the load as long as it wasapplied>>> GENTLY. as soon as the were "shock loaded" about 20% of a gentle load>they>>> shattered.>>>>>> BTW--the tail bows on the flybaby are SPECED for laminated fence post>>ceder.>>>>>> Mike>>> -----Original Message-----
> Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By:>> Michael Brusilow
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>Then answer this question for me why are Louisville sluggers>MADE OF ASH and why did Mr., Pietenpol have ash installed>in the floor at the most critical attachment point (struts) if ASH>can't take loads. My personal opinion is that shock resistance of ASH is>superior to other woods with maybe the exception of maple, this is when>dimensioned the same.>> russell>>>----- Original Message ----->From: Mike Lund >To: >Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 7:09 PM>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>> The load on a single rib in most low-speed light airplanes is so low they>> could probably be made of cardboard and still work OK...oh, wait aminute,>> Molt Talyer did that already...>>>> The main problems in selecting material is the flexability and "flex">> resistance. I once saw some beutiful ribs made of 1/ 16" square ash. you>> could stand on them and the would take the load as long as it was applied>> GENTLY. as soon as the were "shock loaded" about 20% of a gentle loadthey>> shattered.>>>> BTW--the tail bows on the flybaby are SPECED for laminated fence post>ceder.>>>> Mike>> -----Original Message-----
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>Then answer this question for me why are Louisville sluggers>MADE OF ASH and why did Mr., Pietenpol have ash installed>in the floor at the most critical attachment point (struts) if ASH>can't take loads. My personal opinion is that shock resistance of ASH is>superior to other woods with maybe the exception of maple, this is when>dimensioned the same.>> russell>>>----- Original Message ----->From: Mike Lund >To: >Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 7:09 PM>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>> The load on a single rib in most low-speed light airplanes is so low they>> could probably be made of cardboard and still work OK...oh, wait aminute,>> Molt Talyer did that already...>>>> The main problems in selecting material is the flexability and "flex">> resistance. I once saw some beutiful ribs made of 1/ 16" square ash. you>> could stand on them and the would take the load as long as it was applied>> GENTLY. as soon as the were "shock loaded" about 20% of a gentle loadthey>> shattered.>>>> BTW--the tail bows on the flybaby are SPECED for laminated fence post>ceder.>>>> Mike>> -----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: kyle ray
Ash takes loads just fine (in fact, my next airplane project is gonna have3/4" square ash longerons) but it is heavy and has a relatively low shockresistance (still higher than spruce though). It also tends tosplinter/shatter instead of breaking clean (look at a broken bat to get theidea)Remember, these ribs were 1/16" square to get roughly the same weight asspruce ribs (I dont remember which planethey were for-- it was just a "canit be done" type stunt) which I suspect is why they broke when "mistreated"as a general rule ash is 8-10 times stronger than sitka BUT you can't reducethe sizes by a factor of 8-10. You said it exactly right, when dimesionedthe same (or a hair smaller)Mike-----Original Message-----
Ash takes loads just fine (in fact, my next airplane project is gonna have3/4" square ash longerons) but it is heavy and has a relatively low shockresistance (still higher than spruce though). It also tends tosplinter/shatter instead of breaking clean (look at a broken bat to get theidea)Remember, these ribs were 1/16" square to get roughly the same weight asspruce ribs (I dont remember which planethey were for-- it was just a "canit be done" type stunt) which I suspect is why they broke when "mistreated"as a general rule ash is 8-10 times stronger than sitka BUT you can't reducethe sizes by a factor of 8-10. You said it exactly right, when dimesionedthe same (or a hair smaller)Mike-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: Mike Lund
Mike When reading the Flying and Gliding manuals I noted that BernardPietenpol suggested wrapping the longerons with doped fabric strips. hisreasoning was to prevent the longerons splintering when broken making whathe called "toad stabbers". Seems like a good idea to me Bernard claimed thewrapped longerons broke cleanly. I hope I never break mine but the littleadded insurance against being impalled seems like a ggo plan. John-----Original Message-----
Mike When reading the Flying and Gliding manuals I noted that BernardPietenpol suggested wrapping the longerons with doped fabric strips. hisreasoning was to prevent the longerons splintering when broken making whathe called "toad stabbers". Seems like a good idea to me Bernard claimed thewrapped longerons broke cleanly. I hope I never break mine but the littleadded insurance against being impalled seems like a ggo plan. John-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: del magsam
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.The ash in the test ribs was 1/16" square. Ash is a very capablestructural hardwood.Western red cedar is a very capable softwood, highly rot resistantbesides. ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 31 Dec 1999 06:06:12 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.The ash in the test ribs was 1/16" square. Ash is a very capablestructural hardwood.Western red cedar is a very capable softwood, highly rot resistantbesides. ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 31 Dec 1999 06:06:12 -0800 (PST)
> > Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: "Mike Lund"
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>> > >> >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.> >> >> >>> >>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve> >>> >>Steve W GN-1 builder> >>IHA #6> >> >> >Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells the rib> >sets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.> >> >Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )> >> >>>________________________________________________________________________________
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>> > >> >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.> >> >> >>> >>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve> >>> >>Steve W GN-1 builder> >>IHA #6> >> >> >Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells the rib> >sets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.> >> >Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )> >> >>>________________________________________________________________________________
>> > Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: jmcnarry(at)techplus.com (John McNarry)
>> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>> >> >>> >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>> >>> >>> >>>> >>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve>> >>>> >>Steve W GN-1 builder>> >>IHA #6>> >>> >>> >Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells therib>> >sets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.>> >>> >Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )>> >>> >>>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________
>> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>> >> >>> >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>> >>> >>> >>>> >>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve>> >>>> >>Steve W GN-1 builder>> >>IHA #6>> >>> >>> >Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells therib>> >sets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.>> >>> >Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )>> >>> >>>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________
>>> > Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.
Original Posted By: "Domenico Bellissimo"
>>> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>>>>> >>> >>>> >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve>>> >>>>> >>Steve W GN-1 builder>>> >>IHA #6>>> >>>> >>>> >Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells the>rib>>> >sets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.>>> >>>> >Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )>>> >>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________
>>> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>>>>>>>> >>> >>>> >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Western red ceder.>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>Has anyone used this type of wood in building there ribs? >Steve>>> >>>>> >>Steve W GN-1 builder>>> >>IHA #6>>> >>>> >>>> >Sure did. That fellow ( damn, can't remember his name ) who sells the>rib>>> >sets at Brodhead,& a great set of ribs they are, uses ceder.>>> >>>> >Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr sam )>>> >>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________