Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckle Question

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 2:05 pm

Original Posted By: "jimbir"
a few more here. note the intermediate arangement on the rudder.Michael________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckle Question

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:09 am

Original Posted By: Jack Textor
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckle QuestionHi Friends,The plans call for 325SF turnbuckles for the cross braces between the center struts.Can some tell me what these are under current standards? I have som MS21252barrels, thinking they might work. Turnbuckles confuse me!Thanks,JackJack TextorSent from my iPad________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:59 am

Original Posted By: "Speedbrake"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckle QuestionChecking further in the archives, not seeing a comparison...Jack TextorSent from my iPad> On Oct 11, 2016, at 10:09 AM, Jack Textor wrote:> > > Hi Friends,> The plans call for 325SF turnbuckles for the cross braces between the centerstruts. Can some tell me what these are under current standards? I have som MS21252barrels, thinking they might work. Turnbuckles confuse me!> Thanks,> Jack> > Jack Textor> > Sent from my iPad> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Turnbuckle Question

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:08 pm

Original Posted By: "Speedbrake"
Jack, the MS21252 number represents a turnbuckle fork. This number also representsa fork with a lengthwise groove cut down it to facilitate the use of a specialclip as opposed to using safety wire to secure. All components of the turnbuckleassembly must have these cut slots to use the clip system. (Barrel andboth end fittings).The barrel part number, if utilizing the clip type system,for the 3/32" cable isMS21251-B3S. If you want to use a standard barrel, one that requires using safety wire to secure,than that part number, for 3/32" cable is AN155-16S (or L) S=short =2.25"and L=long=4".I used the clip style and have pictures to share if interested.--------Mike PerezRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Turnbuckle Question

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:09 pm

Original Posted By:
Oh, this link may help...http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/a ... ------Mike PerezRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:17 pm

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Speedbrake
Mike,I would be interested in see the pictures you mentioned.BrianMeridian, ID-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:18 pm

Original Posted By: "Charles N. Campbell"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Turnbuckle QuestionJack, Mike is right. I gave you the wrong AN number. Sorry about that.For the 8/32 hardware the -16 is the one to use. ChuckOn Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 1:09 PM, Speedbrake wrote:> speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>>> Oh, this link may help...>> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/a ... liplocking.> php?clickkey=3019393>> --------> Mike Perez>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:26 pm

Original Posted By: "Bill Church"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckle QuestionJack, I can't write anything right today -- I meant 10/32.On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:59 AM, Jack Textor wrote:>> Checking further in the archives, not seeing a comparison...>> Jack Textor>> Sent from my iPad>> > On Oct 11, 2016, at 10:09 AM, Jack Textor wrote:> >> >> > Hi Friends,> > The plans call for 325SF turnbuckles for the cross braces between the> center struts. Can some tell me what these are under current standards? I> have som MS21252 barrels, thinking they might work. Turnbuckles confuse me!> > Thanks,> > Jack> >> > Jack Textor> >> > Sent from my iPad> >> >> >> >> >>>________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Turnbuckle Question

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:30 pm

Original Posted By: Jack Textor
Hey Jack,This one rings a bell. I remember this discussion from a few years ago. Greg Cardinaland Ryan Mueller were able to solve the mystery. Here's a link to thethread:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... rdinalBill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 1:00 pm

Original Posted By: "Speedbrake"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Turnbuckle QuestionAll great info thanks fellows! Now I get to spend some more money!Jack TextorSent from my iPad> On Oct 11, 2016, at 12:18 PM, Charles N. Campbell wrote:> > Jack, Mike is right. I gave you the wrong AN number. Sorry about that. For the 8/32 hardware the -16 is the one to use. Chuck> >> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 1:09 PM, Speedbrake wrote:net>>> >> Oh, this link may help...>> >> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/a ... ey=3019393>> >> -------->> Mike Perez>> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here:>> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 172#461172>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> =========================>> br> enpol-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>> =========================>> FORUMS ->> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com>> =========================>> WIKI ->> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com>> =========================>> b Site ->> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>> =========================>> >> >> > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Turnbuckle Question

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 1:08 pm

Original Posted By: Jack Textor
Jack, having looked through my picture archive, I can't find the pictures I thoughtI had. No biggie; I'll just take a few when I get home...NOPE. Just about2 months ago I packaged up all of my aircraft parts/hardware and have no ideain what box my turnbuckles ended up.Sorry.--------Mike PerezRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 1:13 pm

Original Posted By: "Douwe Blumberg"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Turnbuckle QuestionDon't sweat it Mike thanks!Jack TextorSent from my iPad> On Oct 11, 2016, at 1:08 PM, Speedbrake wrote:> > > Jack, having looked through my picture archive, I can't find the pictures I thoughtI had. No biggie; I'll just take a few when I get home...NOPE. Just about2 months ago I packaged up all of my aircraft parts/hardware and have no ideain what box my turnbuckles ended up.> > Sorry.> > --------> Mike Perez> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 180#461180> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:02 pm

Original Posted By: Jack Textor
Unfotunately I don't have numbers for these things as I acquired themin the flymart at Arlington some years ago. But maybe this pic willgive you some idea of what to look for.ClifThere are two kinds of people in this world:1)Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data> Hi Friends, Turnbuckles confuse me!> Thanks,> Jack________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 5:07 am

Original Posted By: "M W Stanley"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckle QuestionCliff, I missed the attachment..Jack TextorSent from my iPad> On Oct 11, 2016, at 10:02 PM, Clif Dawson wrote:> > > Unfotunately I don't have numbers for these things as I acquired them> in the flymart at Arlington some years ago. But maybe this pic will> give you some idea of what to look for.> > Clif> There are two kinds of people in this world:> 1)Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data> > > >> Hi Friends,> Turnbuckles confuse me!>> Thanks,>> Jack> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 10:26 am

Original Posted By: "oldbird"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckle Question=8B325SF is 1600 lbs. 326SF is 2150 lbs. This means 325 corresponds toAN130-1S and 326S corresponds to AN130-22S. Both turnbuckles are Fork/Cableas I used them. For anyone interested, I have the drawings of the old ones.Happy landingsSemihOn Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 5:07 PM, Jack Textor wrote:>> Interesting Rodney, thanks!>> Jack Textor>> Sent from my iPad>> > On Oct 12, 2016, at 8:51 AM, > wrote:> >> > After doing some research I found what I think may be the source for the> 325 FS designation. I believe it is a precursor for the NAS standard. The> latest NAS standard for turnbuckles includes a lot more information than> the 325 FS but basically the 325 means it is a 5/32nd diameter and the F> means forked. S probably means Steel but it is missing from the newer> standards. I have attached a copy but will see if I can work back to the> original specs from 1940's or earlier.> >> > Rodney> > >>=======================================================>>-- Semih Oksay________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Turnbuckle Question

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 10:28 am

Original Posted By: "Clif Dawson"
325SF is 1600 lbs. 326SF is 2150 lbs. This means 325 corresponds to AN130-1S and326S corresponds to AN130-22S. Both turnbuckles are Fork/Cable as I used them.For anyone interested, I have the drawings of the old ones.Happy landingsSemihRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 10:37 am

Original Posted By: "Jack Philips"
Gee, I wonder how that could possibly happen.After all, I never make mistreaks. :-)Clif> > Cliff, I missed the attachment..> > Jack Textor________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 2:54 pm

Original Posted By: George Abernathy
Rodney,I don't think your information is correct. The attachment you provided is forcable assemblies, not turnbuckles.Below is a link to an online copy of an old book (1918) on Aeronautical Engineering.The section on turnbuckles is on pages 98-99. In Table 4 (p 98) we seesizes 326, 327, 328 etc. Unfortunately they do not list a size 325, but logicwould deduce that it most likely would be one step down in size (and strength)from a size 326. Figure 1 on page 99 provides the relevant dimensions forthe various sizes. For the turnbuckle in question, 325SF, The "S" designationmost likely refers to the "Short" version of the turnbuckle, referred to in thenotes below Table 4, and listed at the bottom of Figure 1. Those notes alsomake reference to the turnbuckles being available in male and female ends. I'll go out on a limb here and assume that the "F" refers to "Female", likelyindicating that the turnbuckle would have two forked ends. A "Male" turnbucklelikely would be furnished with two eye ends, and a turnbuckle without an "M"or "F" designation would likely have one forked end and one eye end.Based on the data available in this old book, it's probably a safe bet to deducethat the 325 turnbuckle would be comparable to the "dash 16" size availabletoday (1600 lbs strength). https://archive.org/details/aeronautica ... ffgoogBill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 20:17:42 +0000 (UTC)

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 3:21 pm

Original Posted By: Ray Krause
While I don't have specific information on the cross from AN numbers and MS numbers,I do have a table of the AN turnbuckle types, which I've attached.In general, there are three types; the AN 130, which are Cable Eye by Fork, CableEye x Pin, and Cable Eye x Cable Eye. These are shown in the attachment, alongwith thread sizes, strengths, and all the dim's needed to complete the installation.--------Tom KreinerRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/turn ... __________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 9:48 pm

Original Posted By: Jack Textor
Bill,What an amazing reference book. And to think this was written in 1918.....just15 years after the Wright Brothers first flew their plane and about 20 years beforeBernard built his Pietenpol. Do you think Bernard consumed all this materialbefore he drew his fuselage design on the barn floor?Wow, those were some mighty intelligent guys back then...no computers, no internet...maybea slide-rule?Bill, you're amazing with all the information you have!Ray KrauseSent from my iPad> On Oct 12, 2016, at 12:54 PM, Bill Church wrote:> > > Rodney,> > I don't think your information is correct. The attachment you provided is forcable assemblies, not turnbuckles.> > Below is a link to an online copy of an old book (1918) on Aeronautical Engineering.The section on turnbuckles is on pages 98-99. In Table 4 (p 98) we seesizes 326, 327, 328 etc. Unfortunately they do not list a size 325, but logicwould deduce that it most likely would be one step down in size (and strength)from a size 326. Figure 1 on page 99 provides the relevant dimensions forthe various sizes. For the turnbuckle in question, 325SF, The "S" designationmost likely refers to the "Short" version of the turnbuckle, referred to inthe notes below Table 4, and listed at the bottom of Figure 1. Those notes alsomake reference to the turnbuckles being available in male and female ends.I'll go out on a limb here and assume that the "F" refers to "Female", likelyindicating that the turnbuckle would have two forked ends. A "Male" turnbucklelikely would be furnished with two eye ends, and a turnbuckle without an "M"or "F" designation would likely have one forked end !> and one eye end.> Based on the data available in this old book, it's probably a safe bet to deducethat the 325 turnbuckle would be comparable to the "dash 16" size availabletoday (1600 lbs strength). > > > https://archive.org/details/aeronauticaleng00huffgoog> > Bill C.> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 217#461217> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________

Brodhead Pietenpol Association