Original Posted By: "l.morlock"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: more on deck angle and landing gearsMike P. makes a very good point in that the wider gear allows for (on the straight axel) the addition of brakes and for meI wanted better visibility when in the 3-point position for landing, taxiing, and takeoff, so I duplicated the deck angle ofthe Aeronca Champ I was used to flying-something like 12 degrees nose high from horizontal.I also raised my seat 2" higher than plans (to improve over-the-nose visibility) which was a big mistake! Too much of my upper body is exposed to the propwashand on long flights I find myself loosening my seat belt to slip down out of the wind some. Had I just left the seat height alone I could haveadded cushions to position me best height-wise.Mike C.________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: more on deck angle and landing gears
Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Original Posted By: "Chris"
As long as the list is discussing deck angles and landing gear. I am trying to get my fuse up on gear and am working on building the steel splitgear. I will be using the Hegar 6" spun aluminum wheels with internal discbrakes. My question is tail wheel. I plan on ordering the Matco 6" Pneumatic tail wheel.I am going with the leaf spring set up to get the wheel back farther for morestable handling. I would like to use the light weight homebuilders leaf fromACS as weight is an issue this far back on the arm. I am concerned it is enoughspring though and am thinking maybe I should just order the 3-leaf Cub spring.They don't publish any info on ACS for this spring. Anybody have any experiencewith it? BTW-I would have preferred the wire wheel look but here I will operate almostexclusively on 1 to 1-1/2 mile long paved runways. I will be bumping regularlywith heavy iron and very active taxiways. It also can be in excess of 130 degreeson the ramp in mid summer. I have deferred looks to use a conventional setup that is proven durable with heavy braking. Thanks, Bryan--------Working Piet N5289BWhile I may not always be right, I apologize well.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
As long as the list is discussing deck angles and landing gear. I am trying to get my fuse up on gear and am working on building the steel splitgear. I will be using the Hegar 6" spun aluminum wheels with internal discbrakes. My question is tail wheel. I plan on ordering the Matco 6" Pneumatic tail wheel.I am going with the leaf spring set up to get the wheel back farther for morestable handling. I would like to use the light weight homebuilders leaf fromACS as weight is an issue this far back on the arm. I am concerned it is enoughspring though and am thinking maybe I should just order the 3-leaf Cub spring.They don't publish any info on ACS for this spring. Anybody have any experiencewith it? BTW-I would have preferred the wire wheel look but here I will operate almostexclusively on 1 to 1-1/2 mile long paved runways. I will be bumping regularlywith heavy iron and very active taxiways. It also can be in excess of 130 degreeson the ramp in mid summer. I have deferred looks to use a conventional setup that is proven durable with heavy braking. Thanks, Bryan--------Working Piet N5289BWhile I may not always be right, I apologize well.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Your absolutely right Gary. The way you and Michael Perez did it is just asgood. The secret to taking the pain out of constructing the wood landinggear is getting the ash block aligned correctly before cutting the gearlegs. The ash block needs to be parallel to the ground when the fuselage isat the desired deck angle AND the outer edge needs to be pointing towardsthe tailskid/wheel. That is the secret. Fix the ash block in space then fillin the blanks with the spruce legs. ChrisSacramento, CaWestcoastpiet.com-----Original Message-----
Your absolutely right Gary. The way you and Michael Perez did it is just asgood. The secret to taking the pain out of constructing the wood landinggear is getting the ash block aligned correctly before cutting the gearlegs. The ash block needs to be parallel to the ground when the fuselage isat the desired deck angle AND the outer edge needs to be pointing towardsthe tailskid/wheel. That is the secret. Fix the ash block in space then fillin the blanks with the spruce legs. ChrisSacramento, CaWestcoastpiet.com-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAA
Original Posted By:> > ** owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAA> Barry,> > They have decided to announce to the world that they are a > business. For> all it's faults it used to be a family business (with some sort of a> guiding principle). At this point it's not about experimental > aviation,it's about money. Thanks but no thanks> > On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 2:00 PM, Barry Davis > > ** ********> > Jack> > Being on the EAA Board of Directors, I can tell you that this article is> > not entirely correct. Also since I am involved, I can't talk about (at this> > time) details other than we are asking a couple of news agencys to correct> > these botched reports like this one. EAA is a great organization and as a> > result I have given them a lot of my time for the past 20 years. Serving on> > the Board will give you a different outlook on what is involved to have> > this organization keep fighting every day to keep our flying freedoms.> > Sometimes this economy dictates that the organization must not spend more> > that it takes in (unlike our government) but the process of action that is> > stated in this article is not correct.> > Barry Davis> > NX973BP> >> > ------------------------------
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAA> Barry,> > They have decided to announce to the world that they are a > business. For> all it's faults it used to be a family business (with some sort of a> guiding principle). At this point it's not about experimental > aviation,it's about money. Thanks but no thanks> > On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 2:00 PM, Barry Davis > > ** ********> > Jack> > Being on the EAA Board of Directors, I can tell you that this article is> > not entirely correct. Also since I am involved, I can't talk about (at this> > time) details other than we are asking a couple of news agencys to correct> > these botched reports like this one. EAA is a great organization and as a> > result I have given them a lot of my time for the past 20 years. Serving on> > the Board will give you a different outlook on what is involved to have> > this organization keep fighting every day to keep our flying freedoms.> > Sometimes this economy dictates that the organization must not spend more> > that it takes in (unlike our government) but the process of action that is> > stated in this article is not correct.> > Barry Davis> > NX973BP> >> > ------------------------------
Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Original Posted By: "Jack Phillips"
Sorry, no practical experience with leaf springs to share.But I'm curious about your statement regarding wire wheels. What difference wouldwire wheels vs others make if you're operating on a long runway. And what differencedoes the temperature make? Bill C.PS "in excess of 130 degrees" ??? Really?Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Sorry, no practical experience with leaf springs to share.But I'm curious about your statement regarding wire wheels. What difference wouldwire wheels vs others make if you're operating on a long runway. And what differencedoes the temperature make? Bill C.PS "in excess of 130 degrees" ??? Really?Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Original Posted By: "Bryan Reed"
Fellow Pietenpol Enthusiasts:The EAA, in the manner of all large, multi-national corporations, has issuedpink slips to about 30 folks in Oshkosh, including Steve Buss, who veryeffectively ran the Young Eagles program, and Jim Koepnick, one of the bestaerial photographers in the world. Apparently Jim didn't take enough photosof warbirds, or of middle-aged men wearing Nomex flight suits.I believe I've been to my last AirVenture. It's gotten too expensive, andit simply isn't as much fun as it used to be. I'll just keep going toBrodhead and Triple Tree and other Fun fly-ins, where the emphasis is onairplanes, not money.Here's an article about it:http://www.flyingmag.com/news/large-sca ... news011312 &spPodID=030I would drop my membership to EAA except that I am a Technical Counselor formy local chapter, and despite the idiots in Oshkosh, our local chapter isactually building airplanes.Jack PhillipsNX899JP________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Fellow Pietenpol Enthusiasts:The EAA, in the manner of all large, multi-national corporations, has issuedpink slips to about 30 folks in Oshkosh, including Steve Buss, who veryeffectively ran the Young Eagles program, and Jim Koepnick, one of the bestaerial photographers in the world. Apparently Jim didn't take enough photosof warbirds, or of middle-aged men wearing Nomex flight suits.I believe I've been to my last AirVenture. It's gotten too expensive, andit simply isn't as much fun as it used to be. I'll just keep going toBrodhead and Triple Tree and other Fun fly-ins, where the emphasis is onairplanes, not money.Here's an article about it:http://www.flyingmag.com/news/large-sca ... news011312 &spPodID=030I would drop my membership to EAA except that I am a Technical Counselor formy local chapter, and despite the idiots in Oshkosh, our local chapter isactually building airplanes.Jack PhillipsNX899JP________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Original Posted By: "Bryan Reed"
Bill wrote:"PS "in excess of 130 degrees" ??? Really?" Bill, Unfortunately yes. When outside temps hit 150 to 120 the blacktop can really heatup. With the long runways comes a long taxi as well as hangar complexes moved furtherfrom the runways. It is not unusual to taxi 1-1/2 miles to the hold shortline. At peak times there may be 20-deep on the taxi ways. Not only is this alot of miles of wear on tires, it also means a lot of braking along the way.Overheated brakes can happen in the best times of the year but it can be exaggeratedduring the summer. I am sure that it is possible to make a spoke wheelwith durable bearings and a decent brake set up but it is difficult to match thewear with a tread that contacts 1/3 the surface. Tire and brake wear on mylast Cessna here was extreme. With my schedule and metal skills (or lack therof: ) It is easier to go with an off the shelf set up to ensure good operationand easy repair/replacement. It is also fairly common to have the tower askfor "expedited arrival" as we have straight in jet traffic as well as turboproptraffic. It is common to fly the pattern throttled up at 100 mph and carrierland with speed and yet make the first ramp to clear the runway for the G4 upyour arse. I am not thrilled about this but it is just the way it is here. Don'tfeel too sad for me though as other parts of flying in Arizona more thanmake up for the airport hassles. Take care, Bryan--------Working Piet N5289BWhile I may not always be right, I apologize well.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Bill wrote:"PS "in excess of 130 degrees" ??? Really?" Bill, Unfortunately yes. When outside temps hit 150 to 120 the blacktop can really heatup. With the long runways comes a long taxi as well as hangar complexes moved furtherfrom the runways. It is not unusual to taxi 1-1/2 miles to the hold shortline. At peak times there may be 20-deep on the taxi ways. Not only is this alot of miles of wear on tires, it also means a lot of braking along the way.Overheated brakes can happen in the best times of the year but it can be exaggeratedduring the summer. I am sure that it is possible to make a spoke wheelwith durable bearings and a decent brake set up but it is difficult to match thewear with a tread that contacts 1/3 the surface. Tire and brake wear on mylast Cessna here was extreme. With my schedule and metal skills (or lack therof: ) It is easier to go with an off the shelf set up to ensure good operationand easy repair/replacement. It is also fairly common to have the tower askfor "expedited arrival" as we have straight in jet traffic as well as turboproptraffic. It is common to fly the pattern throttled up at 100 mph and carrierland with speed and yet make the first ramp to clear the runway for the G4 upyour arse. I am not thrilled about this but it is just the way it is here. Don'tfeel too sad for me though as other parts of flying in Arizona more thanmake up for the airport hassles. Take care, Bryan--------Working Piet N5289BWhile I may not always be right, I apologize well.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Original Posted By: "Bill Church"
This is a heads-up to all the "newbies" out there.If you haven't seen, or don't already own a copy of Mike's DVD, you should popa check in the mail and get yourself one. There are lots of helpful pointers,and inside looks at how these planes go together, as well as things to watch forand pay attention to when building. And there's also a section of footage shotat Brodhead from a few years back. And then, there's the flying scenes. Ifyou get stalled in your building process, just pop the DVD in the player andwatch the flying scenes, and you'll be inspired to go back to the workshop andget going again. Well worth the price of admission. (and also very useful fornon-Pietenpol builders as a cure for insomnia)Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
This is a heads-up to all the "newbies" out there.If you haven't seen, or don't already own a copy of Mike's DVD, you should popa check in the mail and get yourself one. There are lots of helpful pointers,and inside looks at how these planes go together, as well as things to watch forand pay attention to when building. And there's also a section of footage shotat Brodhead from a few years back. And then, there's the flying scenes. Ifyou get stalled in your building process, just pop the DVD in the player andwatch the flying scenes, and you'll be inspired to go back to the workshop andget going again. Well worth the price of admission. (and also very useful fornon-Pietenpol builders as a cure for insomnia)Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: more on deck angle and landing gears
Original Posted By: jeff wilson
Bryan,I guess you're talking about surface temperatures, not air temperatures. That'sa different story. But I'd be cautious regarding the Piet's climbing abilitiesat 120 air temps. And you will probably have a bit of difficulty flying the pattern at 100mph ina Piet... you'd most likely have to be in a dive to achieve that speed. And thenif you plan to use brakes to slow down on the ground, you might find yourselftesting out the functionality of your safety harness system, and looking atthe world from a different perspective. Just sayin'.Are there no smaller, more GA friendly strips around your area?Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 13:22:59 -0800 (PST)
Bryan,I guess you're talking about surface temperatures, not air temperatures. That'sa different story. But I'd be cautious regarding the Piet's climbing abilitiesat 120 air temps. And you will probably have a bit of difficulty flying the pattern at 100mph ina Piet... you'd most likely have to be in a dive to achieve that speed. And thenif you plan to use brakes to slow down on the ground, you might find yourselftesting out the functionality of your safety harness system, and looking atthe world from a different perspective. Just sayin'.Are there no smaller, more GA friendly strips around your area?Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 13:22:59 -0800 (PST)
Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Original Posted By: "Piet2112"
Bill, Shudder the thought. You mean my 75hp Piet won't climb like a homesick angelwith me and my 250lb friend on board??? Who do I talk to about getting my moneyback on this mere mortal airplane?? Unfortunately we are very familiar with DA here. It really limits us in the summerwith the high altitude runways. I had a scare years ago at Grand CanyonAirport with 6600ft actual and 87deg afternoon. I am quite a cowardly pilot withhigh density altitude now. I flew for years out of DVT and became accustomed to crowded airports. It reallydoesn't bother me but it does take a toll on brakes and tires doing that muchtaxiing. With high temps comes long runways and thus lots of taxiing. Unfortunatlythat is standard flying here. Thanks, Bryan--------Working Piet N5289BWhile I may not always be right, I apologize well.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Bill, Shudder the thought. You mean my 75hp Piet won't climb like a homesick angelwith me and my 250lb friend on board??? Who do I talk to about getting my moneyback on this mere mortal airplane?? Unfortunately we are very familiar with DA here. It really limits us in the summerwith the high altitude runways. I had a scare years ago at Grand CanyonAirport with 6600ft actual and 87deg afternoon. I am quite a cowardly pilot withhigh density altitude now. I flew for years out of DVT and became accustomed to crowded airports. It reallydoesn't bother me but it does take a toll on brakes and tires doing that muchtaxiing. With high temps comes long runways and thus lots of taxiing. Unfortunatlythat is standard flying here. Thanks, Bryan--------Working Piet N5289BWhile I may not always be right, I apologize well.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Original Posted By: "Jack Phillips"
In regards to the ash block, why are you canting it inward?The plans show it parallel to the ground, but shouldn't it be perpendicularto the axle?The last time I was at the Frontiers of Flight Museum in Dallas, I took aclose look at their Curtiss JN-4D Jenny to answer that very question.On the Jenny, it's perpendicular.Curt MerdanFlower Mound, TXRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
In regards to the ash block, why are you canting it inward?The plans show it parallel to the ground, but shouldn't it be perpendicularto the axle?The last time I was at the Frontiers of Flight Museum in Dallas, I took aclose look at their Curtiss JN-4D Jenny to answer that very question.On the Jenny, it's perpendicular.Curt MerdanFlower Mound, TXRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAA
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Barry,I have tremendous respect for you as one of the few at EAA who have actuallybuilt an airplane (which I feel should be an absolute Requirement for thepresident of the organization). If you say it's good, it almost cetainlyis, but it sure doesn't sound like it.The economy sucks, no question. But if they did this not as a cost-cuttingmeasure, then all these folks must have been incompetent. I have knownSteve Buss for years and can say he's many things, but incompetent is NOTone of them. Most likely he didn't fit in with the new regime (he doesn'tfly warbirds).It has been many years since EAA was concerned with building airplanesregistered as Experimental. If they are not concerned with homebuiltaircraft, why should we support them? AOPA has a better lobby.Sorry, I'm a bit bitter over this. I consider Steve Buss a friend, and heand Jim Koepnick the best assets EAA has since they lost Jack Cox.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____
Barry,I have tremendous respect for you as one of the few at EAA who have actuallybuilt an airplane (which I feel should be an absolute Requirement for thepresident of the organization). If you say it's good, it almost cetainlyis, but it sure doesn't sound like it.The economy sucks, no question. But if they did this not as a cost-cuttingmeasure, then all these folks must have been incompetent. I have knownSteve Buss for years and can say he's many things, but incompetent is NOTone of them. Most likely he didn't fit in with the new regime (he doesn'tfly warbirds).It has been many years since EAA was concerned with building airplanesregistered as Experimental. If they are not concerned with homebuiltaircraft, why should we support them? AOPA has a better lobby.Sorry, I'm a bit bitter over this. I consider Steve Buss a friend, and heand Jim Koepnick the best assets EAA has since they lost Jack Cox.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Curt, all I can say is "Try it". I thought the same way, and made dozens of(fortunately, Pine) "practice struts, trying to get the cuts to line up. Icould get a perfectly flush cut at the fuselage, or at the V-block, but notboth. Once I canted the V-blocks it was easy to get a good fit at bothends.I'll send you pictures if you wish...Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----
Curt, all I can say is "Try it". I thought the same way, and made dozens of(fortunately, Pine) "practice struts, trying to get the cuts to line up. Icould get a perfectly flush cut at the fuselage, or at the V-block, but notboth. Once I canted the V-blocks it was easy to get a good fit at bothends.I'll send you pictures if you wish...Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAA
Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAA
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAA
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Original Posted By: helspersew(at)aol.com
Curt,Doesn't seem logical, but I believe that's the way they're supposed to be.See the attached clip from the FGM drawings. As you can see in the circled areas,the blocks appear to be drawn canted towards the tail.Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/cant ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Curt,Doesn't seem logical, but I believe that's the way they're supposed to be.See the attached clip from the FGM drawings. As you can see in the circled areas,the blocks appear to be drawn canted towards the tail.Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/cant ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Original Posted By: Piet2112
Curt,Fortunately I benefited from the advice of Mike Cuy and Jack Phillips. They both revealed to me that in order to make that straight-axle gear work out, the ash blocks had to "aim" back at the tailwheel bracket in order to fit together geometrically. This was of course before Chris Tracy posted his how-to on Westcoastpiet.com.Dan HelsperPuryear, TN-----Original Message-----
Curt,Fortunately I benefited from the advice of Mike Cuy and Jack Phillips. They both revealed to me that in order to make that straight-axle gear work out, the ash blocks had to "aim" back at the tailwheel bracket in order to fit together geometrically. This was of course before Chris Tracy posted his how-to on Westcoastpiet.com.Dan HelsperPuryear, TN-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAA
Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAAJust like some corporations, Organizations can lose sight of their mission andpick up other agendas. These businesses start to be run by management for managementand not the stockholders. The EAA does a lot of great stuff. Specificallywith the Young Eagle program. The Poberezenys (SP) were pretty much benevolentrulers who did advance avition by in large. AOPA is pretty good as well.ABS has had some rough and tumble politics this last couple of years but stillseems to be focused. Some Orgs that have wandered at times: IMHOThe NRA for a while drifted away from it's mission gun rights and support for gunowners into a very right leaning organization on all issues. After alienatingmany moderate members, it seems to be focused again. The "nonprofit" AARP is actually a "for-profit" that is run as a business witha tiny non-profit foundation. I won't deal with them.Some VFW posts are bastions of Right wing politics. "If you are a Vet you mustbe a right thinking American!" Their mission is honoring the dead, Supportingmilitary comrades,widows and patriotism. In the military, we call this mission creep. IE We went into Somalia to make surethat humanitarian aid was reaching those who needed it and not being stolenby the warlords. Then we started to try to catch the warlords, then we thoughtwe would build a government. Ended up being a failure.In the former Yugoslavia we went in to stop the killing, then we started to nationbuild and peacekeep. That mission has been a success. Not all mission creepis bad. It is difficult to determine what happens when the leadership starts making bigpaychecks. Blue Skies,Steve D----- Original Message -----
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steve Buss, Jim Koepnick get the AX at EAAJust like some corporations, Organizations can lose sight of their mission andpick up other agendas. These businesses start to be run by management for managementand not the stockholders. The EAA does a lot of great stuff. Specificallywith the Young Eagle program. The Poberezenys (SP) were pretty much benevolentrulers who did advance avition by in large. AOPA is pretty good as well.ABS has had some rough and tumble politics this last couple of years but stillseems to be focused. Some Orgs that have wandered at times: IMHOThe NRA for a while drifted away from it's mission gun rights and support for gunowners into a very right leaning organization on all issues. After alienatingmany moderate members, it seems to be focused again. The "nonprofit" AARP is actually a "for-profit" that is run as a business witha tiny non-profit foundation. I won't deal with them.Some VFW posts are bastions of Right wing politics. "If you are a Vet you mustbe a right thinking American!" Their mission is honoring the dead, Supportingmilitary comrades,widows and patriotism. In the military, we call this mission creep. IE We went into Somalia to make surethat humanitarian aid was reaching those who needed it and not being stolenby the warlords. Then we started to try to catch the warlords, then we thoughtwe would build a government. Ended up being a failure.In the former Yugoslavia we went in to stop the killing, then we started to nationbuild and peacekeep. That mission has been a success. Not all mission creepis bad. It is difficult to determine what happens when the leadership starts making bigpaychecks. Blue Skies,Steve D----- Original Message -----
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: My Piet is out of long term storage
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Set up is simple...tie 2 strings to the tail post and extend each one to theforward end of the blocks. That's the angle you need.Gary from CoolNX308MB-----Original Message-----
Set up is simple...tie 2 strings to the tail post and extend each one to theforward end of the blocks. That's the angle you need.Gary from CoolNX308MB-----Original Message-----