Original Posted By: Warren Shoun
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>Hey Mike,> So help us out with the other half of this bridge....where is the Hatzweb>site?>Warren>________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: wing construction (on L.E.)
Pietenpol-List: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Richard DeCosta
Hello Piet'n Pals,I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piecewing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challenge isto build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I can extendabout 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosed backporch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces, to puton the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform on top ofthe carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms tosupport the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge about afoot off the floor, and keep everything level and square. After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able to coverit in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) to supportthe wing. So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Is thisan example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcomeconstruction challenges?Chuckp.s. I don't have a wife.________________________________________________________________________________
Hello Piet'n Pals,I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piecewing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challenge isto build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I can extendabout 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosed backporch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces, to puton the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform on top ofthe carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms tosupport the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge about afoot off the floor, and keep everything level and square. After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able to coverit in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) to supportthe wing. So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Is thisan example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcomeconstruction challenges?Chuckp.s. I don't have a wife.________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Larry Pasley
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>>>Michael D Cuy wrote:>>> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that couldexplode in>> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3piece>> >wing.>> >>> >Gordon>>>> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one cargarage.>> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car>> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards>> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against>> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the>> morning.>>>> MC>>I still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88 isno>worse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in the morningtoo.>>Gordon>>________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>>>Michael D Cuy wrote:>>> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that couldexplode in>> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3piece>> >wing.>> >>> >Gordon>>>> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one cargarage.>> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car>> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards>> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against>> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the>> morning.>>>> MC>>I still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88 isno>worse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in the morningtoo.>>Gordon>>________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> Hello Piet'n Pals,> I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piece> wing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challenge is> to build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I can extend> about 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosed back> porch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces, to put> on the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform on top of> the carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms to> support the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge about a> foot off the floor, and keep everything level and square.> After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able to cover> it in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) to support> the wing.> So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Is this> an example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcome> construction challenges?>> Chuck>> p.s. I don't have a wife.You sound like a boat builder to me Chuck, and not having a wife makes it easierto make those decisions. I used to work out in garage all nite and crash on theold couch when I was single. 31 yrs ago. Now I am retired and on new property withno nice garage as of yet, only two 10' x 14' sheds and they are cold. I am gettingready to start a plane and will probably make my ribs in the house. I could usethe Den I think it is 15' but that is not enough for even my Ultra Piet for a onepiece wing.I know nothing about the building jig setup for the real piet so I can't guideyou. I am sure some of the other builders can tell you which is a good way to go.Anyway have fun and don't get Pizza Sauce drippings on the wood.Only thing better in Life than building an Airplane is Building two Airplanes.Gordon________________________________________________________________________________
Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> Hello Piet'n Pals,> I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piece> wing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challenge is> to build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I can extend> about 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosed back> porch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces, to put> on the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform on top of> the carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms to> support the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge about a> foot off the floor, and keep everything level and square.> After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able to cover> it in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) to support> the wing.> So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Is this> an example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcome> construction challenges?>> Chuck>> p.s. I don't have a wife.You sound like a boat builder to me Chuck, and not having a wife makes it easierto make those decisions. I used to work out in garage all nite and crash on theold couch when I was single. 31 yrs ago. Now I am retired and on new property withno nice garage as of yet, only two 10' x 14' sheds and they are cold. I am gettingready to start a plane and will probably make my ribs in the house. I could usethe Den I think it is 15' but that is not enough for even my Ultra Piet for a onepiece wing.I know nothing about the building jig setup for the real piet so I can't guideyou. I am sure some of the other builders can tell you which is a good way to go.Anyway have fun and don't get Pizza Sauce drippings on the wood.Only thing better in Life than building an Airplane is Building two Airplanes.Gordon________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List:
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
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Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
>The primary consideration for building the wing is to keep everything inone plane>(no pun intended). As I recall there is no wash out for the Piet wing Chuck- I built my Piet in my living and dinning room (with no wife)but did all of my sawdust work downstairs. It was WONDERFUL.I could watch the news, go to the fridge, answer the phone, see thedriveway, watch the weather outside...etc.... I kept everything veryneat and orderly......it wasn't like redoing a greasy old engine or something. Regarding the washout----you don't need to 'build' that into thewing. If you use an adjustable rear strut fork end or use Bernie'sadjustable upper wing end fittings (essentially making differentlength fittings to suit your needs) you can put the washout desiredin on the wings to keep your ailerons flying right up to stall.It DOES help. I tried it with and without, and I left it in 3/8" wash.Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
>The primary consideration for building the wing is to keep everything inone plane>(no pun intended). As I recall there is no wash out for the Piet wing Chuck- I built my Piet in my living and dinning room (with no wife)but did all of my sawdust work downstairs. It was WONDERFUL.I could watch the news, go to the fridge, answer the phone, see thedriveway, watch the weather outside...etc.... I kept everything veryneat and orderly......it wasn't like redoing a greasy old engine or something. Regarding the washout----you don't need to 'build' that into thewing. If you use an adjustable rear strut fork end or use Bernie'sadjustable upper wing end fittings (essentially making differentlength fittings to suit your needs) you can put the washout desiredin on the wings to keep your ailerons flying right up to stall.It DOES help. I tried it with and without, and I left it in 3/8" wash.Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Ed Nolan
The primary consideration for building the wing is to keep everything in one plane(no pun intended). As I recall there is no wash out for the Piet wing so the ideais to keep all the ribs at the same location up and down (in your case for andaft) on the spar. If you build the one piece wing the way it shows in the plans,you can build the entire wing in two panels and splice it after it is assembled.Iwouldn't use the type splicce shown in the plans, I'd use a standard scarf splice.Since the center section is in compression, the original splice is OK but I don'tcare for the idea of carriage bolts and nails holding it together. If you do itintwo pieces and then splice it, do you have room to assemble in the moreconventional horizontal method?One further note: If you don't have to spray on a verticle surface, DON"T. It'smuch easier to paint on horizontal surfaces. After the wing is covered, set itupon horses to paint. Likewise when you are going to spray the fuselage, make a jigto rotate the fuselage. Painting will be much easier.Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> Hello Piet'n Pals,> I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piece> wing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challenge is> to build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I can extend> about 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosed back> porch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces, to put> on the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform on top of> the carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms to> support the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge about a> foot off the floor, and keep everything level and square.> After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able to cover> it in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) to support> the wing.> So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Is this> an example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcome> construction challenges?>> Chuck>> p.s. I don't have a wife.--David B.Schober, CPEInstructor, Aviation MaintenanceFairmont State CollegeNational Aerospace Education CenterRt. 3 Box 13Bridgeport, WV 26330-9503(304) 842-8300________________________________________________________________________________
The primary consideration for building the wing is to keep everything in one plane(no pun intended). As I recall there is no wash out for the Piet wing so the ideais to keep all the ribs at the same location up and down (in your case for andaft) on the spar. If you build the one piece wing the way it shows in the plans,you can build the entire wing in two panels and splice it after it is assembled.Iwouldn't use the type splicce shown in the plans, I'd use a standard scarf splice.Since the center section is in compression, the original splice is OK but I don'tcare for the idea of carriage bolts and nails holding it together. If you do itintwo pieces and then splice it, do you have room to assemble in the moreconventional horizontal method?One further note: If you don't have to spray on a verticle surface, DON"T. It'smuch easier to paint on horizontal surfaces. After the wing is covered, set itupon horses to paint. Likewise when you are going to spray the fuselage, make a jigto rotate the fuselage. Painting will be much easier.Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> Hello Piet'n Pals,> I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piece> wing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challenge is> to build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I can extend> about 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosed back> porch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces, to put> on the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform on top of> the carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms to> support the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge about a> foot off the floor, and keep everything level and square.> After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able to cover> it in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) to support> the wing.> So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Is this> an example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcome> construction challenges?>> Chuck>> p.s. I don't have a wife.--David B.Schober, CPEInstructor, Aviation MaintenanceFairmont State CollegeNational Aerospace Education CenterRt. 3 Box 13Bridgeport, WV 26330-9503(304) 842-8300________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Michael D Cuy wrote:> >The primary consideration for building the wing is to keep everything in> one plane> >(no pun intended). As I recall there is no wash out for the Piet wing>> Chuck- I built my Piet in my living and dinning room (with no wife)> but did all of my sawdust work downstairs. It was WONDERFUL.> I could watch the news, go to the fridge, answer the phone, see the> driveway, watch the weather outside...etc.... I kept everything very> neat and orderly......it wasn't like redoing a greasy old engine or> something.> Regarding the washout----you don't need to 'build' that into the> wing. If you use an adjustable rear strut fork end or use Bernie's> adjustable upper wing end fittings (essentially making different> length fittings to suit your needs) you can put the washout desired> in on the wings to keep your ailerons flying right up to stall.> It DOES help. I tried it with and without, and I left it in 3/8" wash.>> Mike C.So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could explode inthe house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3 piecewing.Gordon________________________________________________________________________________
Michael D Cuy wrote:> >The primary consideration for building the wing is to keep everything in> one plane> >(no pun intended). As I recall there is no wash out for the Piet wing>> Chuck- I built my Piet in my living and dinning room (with no wife)> but did all of my sawdust work downstairs. It was WONDERFUL.> I could watch the news, go to the fridge, answer the phone, see the> driveway, watch the weather outside...etc.... I kept everything very> neat and orderly......it wasn't like redoing a greasy old engine or> something.> Regarding the washout----you don't need to 'build' that into the> wing. If you use an adjustable rear strut fork end or use Bernie's> adjustable upper wing end fittings (essentially making different> length fittings to suit your needs) you can put the washout desired> in on the wings to keep your ailerons flying right up to stall.> It DOES help. I tried it with and without, and I left it in 3/8" wash.>> Mike C.So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could explode inthe house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3 piecewing.Gordon________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Richard DeCosta
>So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could explode in>the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3 piece>wing.>>GordonSteve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car garage.I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one cargarage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazardsbesides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard againstallergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in themorning. MC________________________________________________________________________________
>So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could explode in>the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3 piece>wing.>>GordonSteve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car garage.I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one cargarage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazardsbesides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard againstallergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in themorning. MC________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
Michael D Cuy wrote:> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could explode in> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3 piece> >wing.> >> >Gordon>> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car garage.> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the> morning.>> MCI still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88 is noworse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in the morning too.Gordon________________________________________________________________________________
Michael D Cuy wrote:> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could explode in> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3 piece> >wing.> >> >Gordon>> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car garage.> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the> morning.>> MCI still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88 is noworse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in the morning too.Gordon________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: mboynton(at)excite.com
On Fri, 11 Dec 1998, Michael D Cuy wrote:> Chuck- I built my Piet in my living and dinning room (with no wife)> but did all of my sawdust work downstairs. It was WONDERFUL.> I could watch the news, go to the fridge, answer the phone, see the> driveway, watch the weather outside...etc.... I kept everything very> neat and orderly......it wasn't like redoing a greasy old engine or > something. I have a wonderful wife who encourages me to buy what I want. When I foundthe last engine, she said "Don't bore me with the details, just buy it!".I have pretty much full rein of the basement which includes phone, radio,cable TV (for watching Sport Aviation, don't 'cha know). Fortunately, thegarage is in the basement making the removal of the A/C trivial.Ken________________________________________________________________________________
On Fri, 11 Dec 1998, Michael D Cuy wrote:> Chuck- I built my Piet in my living and dinning room (with no wife)> but did all of my sawdust work downstairs. It was WONDERFUL.> I could watch the news, go to the fridge, answer the phone, see the> driveway, watch the weather outside...etc.... I kept everything very> neat and orderly......it wasn't like redoing a greasy old engine or > something. I have a wonderful wife who encourages me to buy what I want. When I foundthe last engine, she said "Don't bore me with the details, just buy it!".I have pretty much full rein of the basement which includes phone, radio,cable TV (for watching Sport Aviation, don't 'cha know). Fortunately, thegarage is in the basement making the removal of the A/C trivial.Ken________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Warren Shoun
This was done by a local builder some years back on a Star Duster II. Hehad to tear some of his wall out to remove it when finished. You didn't have to say you were not married. I'd already guessed.Thanks, Larry> Hello Piet'n Pals,> I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piece> wing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challengeis> to build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I canextend> about 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosedback> porch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces,to put> on the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform ontop of> the carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms to> support the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge abouta> foot off the floor, and keep everything level and square. > After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able tocover> it in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) tosupport> the wing. > So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Isthis> an example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcome> construction challenges?> > Chuck> > p.s. I don't have a wife.> ________________________________________________________________________________
This was done by a local builder some years back on a Star Duster II. Hehad to tear some of his wall out to remove it when finished. You didn't have to say you were not married. I'd already guessed.Thanks, Larry> Hello Piet'n Pals,> I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piece> wing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challengeis> to build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I canextend> about 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosedback> porch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces,to put> on the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform ontop of> the carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms to> support the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge abouta> foot off the floor, and keep everything level and square. > After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able tocover> it in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) tosupport> the wing. > So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Isthis> an example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcome> construction challenges?> > Chuck> > p.s. I don't have a wife.> ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: steve(at)byu.edu
Hey Mike, So help us out with the other half of this bridge....where is the Hatz website?Warren________________________________________________________________________________
Hey Mike, So help us out with the other half of this bridge....where is the Hatz website?Warren________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: steve(at)byu.edu
http://www.weebeastie.com/hatzcb1/Stevee-----Original Message-----Warren ShounSent: Friday, December 11, 1998 2:52 PMSubject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)Hey Mike, So help us out with the other half of this bridge....where is the Hatzwebsite?Warren________________________________________________________________________________
http://www.weebeastie.com/hatzcb1/Stevee-----Original Message-----Warren ShounSent: Friday, December 11, 1998 2:52 PMSubject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)Hey Mike, So help us out with the other half of this bridge....where is the Hatzwebsite?Warren________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
Hey Gordon, That's "Ambroid in the morning" if you are a real old timer!..There is a pretty good test report on T-88 over on the Hatz website that youmight want to read. Mostly about gluing metal to metal and metal to wood,but it has some good info. It seems to indicate that the bottom temp forreliable curing is 35F. After reading everything I can find and using theglue the general consensus is that if you get the mixture somewhere near50/50 , don't clamp it too tightly, and give it however much time isrequired for it to cure at your tempurature, then you will get an airworthybond. I have been using the stuff to build my Hatz ribs in my model airplaneshop (in the house). If you already have a model airplane shop why would youbuild your 1 to 1 scale Piet anywhere else? (I am still wondering ifI can get away with welding in the living room when the time comes).MikeHatz 710-----Original Message-----
Hey Gordon, That's "Ambroid in the morning" if you are a real old timer!..There is a pretty good test report on T-88 over on the Hatz website that youmight want to read. Mostly about gluing metal to metal and metal to wood,but it has some good info. It seems to indicate that the bottom temp forreliable curing is 35F. After reading everything I can find and using theglue the general consensus is that if you get the mixture somewhere near50/50 , don't clamp it too tightly, and give it however much time isrequired for it to cure at your tempurature, then you will get an airworthybond. I have been using the stuff to build my Hatz ribs in my model airplaneshop (in the house). If you already have a model airplane shop why would youbuild your 1 to 1 scale Piet anywhere else? (I am still wondering ifI can get away with welding in the living room when the time comes).MikeHatz 710-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Gary Gower
>Hello Piet'n Pals,>I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piece>wing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challenge is>to build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I can extend>about 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosed back>porch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces, to put>on the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform on top of>the carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms to>support the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge about a>foot off the floor, and keep everything level and square. >After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able to cover>it in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) to support>the wing. >So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Is this>an example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcome>construction challenges?>>Chuck>>p.s. I don't have a wife.>>Well I think that the:p.s. I don't have a wife Should had been at the beguining of your post :-)Couldnt pay to much atention the first time just imagining a wife's face.SaludosGary Gower________________________________________________________________________________
>Hello Piet'n Pals,>I am now ready to begin building my wing, and plan on using the one piece>wing. I have limited space, and it's too cold outside, so, my challenge is>to build it in my living room, standing up on the leading edge. I can extend>about 1 1/2 feet of the wing out through the back door, to the enclosed back>porch. I plan on using a sheet of plywood, ripped into 2' X 8' pieces, to put>on the floor, on top of the tarp. This should give a good platform on top of>the carpet. Then make five vertical 2 X 4's, with 2 horizontal arms to>support the spars. I'll adjust the height to keep the leading edge about a>foot off the floor, and keep everything level and square. >After all the wood work, and rigging is done, I think I might be able to cover>it in the same attitude, if I use the hardpoints (struts & cabane) to support>the wing. >So...I ask you. Has anyone ever done, or heard of it done this way? Is this>an example of insanity, or just another homebuilders method to overcome>construction challenges?>>Chuck>>p.s. I don't have a wife.>>Well I think that the:p.s. I don't have a wife Should had been at the beguining of your post :-)Couldnt pay to much atention the first time just imagining a wife's face.SaludosGary Gower________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
Dave,Keeping everything level and square should be a matter of checking itperiodically, throughout the construction process. My spars are already done,using the standard scarf splice. The splice is, however not located in thecenter, (it's at about the 13' station) therefore I cannot build it in twopanels. Spars are 4- 3/4 X 3/4 Douglas Fir. I will use 1/8" shims,on eachside at each rib, to keep it in the proper location.I believe washout is reserved for tapered wing planform. A Hershey bar winginherently stalls at the inboard section first, thus, ailerons remaineffective.As for paint, I think I'm going to brush it on...simple, cheaper, no specialequipment.Chuck"Know your airplane, know it well, know its limitations, and above all -- knowyour own limitations" ~~ Bob Hoover ~~________________________________________________________________________________
Dave,Keeping everything level and square should be a matter of checking itperiodically, throughout the construction process. My spars are already done,using the standard scarf splice. The splice is, however not located in thecenter, (it's at about the 13' station) therefore I cannot build it in twopanels. Spars are 4- 3/4 X 3/4 Douglas Fir. I will use 1/8" shims,on eachside at each rib, to keep it in the proper location.I believe washout is reserved for tapered wing planform. A Hershey bar winginherently stalls at the inboard section first, thus, ailerons remaineffective.As for paint, I think I'm going to brush it on...simple, cheaper, no specialequipment.Chuck"Know your airplane, know it well, know its limitations, and above all -- knowyour own limitations" ~~ Bob Hoover ~~________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
Mike,I'll keep the sawdust out in the garage. It is great to have a heated area tobuild in, and all the other stuff ya mentioned, as I did all the ribs, andfiberglass fuel tank in the dining room. Did you use an adjustable rear strut fork end?Chuck________________________________________________________________________________
Mike,I'll keep the sawdust out in the garage. It is great to have a heated area tobuild in, and all the other stuff ya mentioned, as I did all the ribs, andfiberglass fuel tank in the dining room. Did you use an adjustable rear strut fork end?Chuck________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
Gordon,I'm using T88, and hardly have any fumes from it, however the fiberglass fueltank was a different story. I had really strong fumes in the house duringthat phase of construction, and it effected the inside of my nose. I'm goingto set up a small ventilation fan, maybe a bathroom exhaust fan with flexiblepipe or something, to complete the tank.Chuck"The laws of Aerodynamics are unforgiving and the ground is hard." ________________________________________________________________________________
Gordon,I'm using T88, and hardly have any fumes from it, however the fiberglass fueltank was a different story. I had really strong fumes in the house duringthat phase of construction, and it effected the inside of my nose. I'm goingto set up a small ventilation fan, maybe a bathroom exhaust fan with flexiblepipe or something, to complete the tank.Chuck"The laws of Aerodynamics are unforgiving and the ground is hard." ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Dave and Connie
Larry,It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the front door,with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the houseuneffected. Chuck________________________________________________________________________________
Larry,It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the front door,with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the houseuneffected. Chuck________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By:>> Gordon Brimhall
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>I remember Ambroid.>>I also remember when I got my allowance 50 cents I got Mom to take me toJiggs>Hobby shop and I had to go behind the counter as I could not see over it to>select my projects for the weekend. 2 comet stick airplanes 10 cents eachand a>tube of glue. Used to get a good size tube for a dime. I would give almost>anything to have some of them models now that I built. I still have about60 old>new in the box Top Flight props I bought in the 60's after getting out ofthe>Air Force. Also sitting next to me as I just got it out of my treasurecabinet>is a OK CUB Engine Accessory Kit. Has two wrenches, battery connector and a>small can of OK Cub Glow Fuel, still unopened. Cat No. 970 Cost $1.49>>I also have a NIB McCoy 40 RC Bluehead, maybe I will scale down a Piet andbuild>a model RC, put in my old HeathKit RC stuff and fly it. I sold out most mymodel>airplane stuff years back when we moved onto our sailboat so now I have tostart>collecting all over and this time it will be real airplane stuff.>>Old memories are great but new challanges are even greater.>>Gordon>>>Mike Cunningham wrote:>>> Hey Gordon, That's "Ambroid in the morning" if you are a real oldtimer!..>> There is a pretty good test report on T-88 over on the Hatz website thatyou>> might want to read. Mostly about gluing metal to metal and metal to wood,>> but it has some good info. It seems to indicate that the bottom temp for>> reliable curing is 35F. After reading everything I can find and using the>> glue the general consensus is that if you get the mixture somewhere near>> 50/50 , don't clamp it too tightly, and give it however much time is>> required for it to cure at your tempurature, then you will get anairworthy>> bond. I have been using the stuff to build my Hatz ribs in my modelairplane>> shop (in the house). If you already have a model airplane shop why wouldyou>> build your 1 to 1 scale Piet anywhere else? (I am still wondering if>> I can get away with welding in the living room when the time comes).>>>> Mike>> Hatz 710>> -----Original Message-----
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>I remember Ambroid.>>I also remember when I got my allowance 50 cents I got Mom to take me toJiggs>Hobby shop and I had to go behind the counter as I could not see over it to>select my projects for the weekend. 2 comet stick airplanes 10 cents eachand a>tube of glue. Used to get a good size tube for a dime. I would give almost>anything to have some of them models now that I built. I still have about60 old>new in the box Top Flight props I bought in the 60's after getting out ofthe>Air Force. Also sitting next to me as I just got it out of my treasurecabinet>is a OK CUB Engine Accessory Kit. Has two wrenches, battery connector and a>small can of OK Cub Glow Fuel, still unopened. Cat No. 970 Cost $1.49>>I also have a NIB McCoy 40 RC Bluehead, maybe I will scale down a Piet andbuild>a model RC, put in my old HeathKit RC stuff and fly it. I sold out most mymodel>airplane stuff years back when we moved onto our sailboat so now I have tostart>collecting all over and this time it will be real airplane stuff.>>Old memories are great but new challanges are even greater.>>Gordon>>>Mike Cunningham wrote:>>> Hey Gordon, That's "Ambroid in the morning" if you are a real oldtimer!..>> There is a pretty good test report on T-88 over on the Hatz website thatyou>> might want to read. Mostly about gluing metal to metal and metal to wood,>> but it has some good info. It seems to indicate that the bottom temp for>> reliable curing is 35F. After reading everything I can find and using the>> glue the general consensus is that if you get the mixture somewhere near>> 50/50 , don't clamp it too tightly, and give it however much time is>> required for it to cure at your tempurature, then you will get anairworthy>> bond. I have been using the stuff to build my Hatz ribs in my modelairplane>> shop (in the house). If you already have a model airplane shop why wouldyou>> build your 1 to 1 scale Piet anywhere else? (I am still wondering if>> I can get away with welding in the living room when the time comes).>>>> Mike>> Hatz 710>> -----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: "D.J.H."
ChuckThanks for info on T88 I was worried about my plan to do ribs in the warm house.It was 14 degrees yesterday morning and then got to 50 something, we are at 2000ft in the High Desert.I can cut most my wood in my shed and maybe just bring in my electric searsbelt/disk sander with my shop vac to trim parts with. This is going to be fun tostart building my Baby Piet. Don't laugh guys, Got to start someplace. Anywaymyreasoning is, I will have an airplane to fly if and when I loose my Medical.GordonRcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> Gordon,> I'm using T88, and hardly have any fumes from it, however the fiberglass fuel> tank was a different story. I had really strong fumes in the house during> that phase of construction, and it effected the inside of my nose. I'm going> to set up a small ventilation fan, maybe a bathroom exhaust fan with flexible> pipe or something, to complete the tank.>> Chuck>> "The laws of Aerodynamics are unforgiving and the ground is hard."________________________________________________________________________________
ChuckThanks for info on T88 I was worried about my plan to do ribs in the warm house.It was 14 degrees yesterday morning and then got to 50 something, we are at 2000ft in the High Desert.I can cut most my wood in my shed and maybe just bring in my electric searsbelt/disk sander with my shop vac to trim parts with. This is going to be fun tostart building my Baby Piet. Don't laugh guys, Got to start someplace. Anywaymyreasoning is, I will have an airplane to fly if and when I loose my Medical.GordonRcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> Gordon,> I'm using T88, and hardly have any fumes from it, however the fiberglass fuel> tank was a different story. I had really strong fumes in the house during> that phase of construction, and it effected the inside of my nose. I'm going> to set up a small ventilation fan, maybe a bathroom exhaust fan with flexible> pipe or something, to complete the tank.>> Chuck>> "The laws of Aerodynamics are unforgiving and the ground is hard."________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By:> Gordon Brimhall
I remember Ambroid.I also remember when I got my allowance 50 cents I got Mom to take me to JiggsHobby shop and I had to go behind the counter as I could not see over it toselect my projects for the weekend. 2 comet stick airplanes 10 cents each and atube of glue. Used to get a good size tube for a dime. I would give almostanything to have some of them models now that I built. I still have about 60 oldnew in the box Top Flight props I bought in the 60's after getting out of theAir Force. Also sitting next to me as I just got it out of my treasure cabinetis a OK CUB Engine Accessory Kit. Has two wrenches, battery connector and asmall can of OK Cub Glow Fuel, still unopened. Cat No. 970 Cost $1.49I also have a NIB McCoy 40 RC Bluehead, maybe I will scale down a Piet and builda model RC, put in my old HeathKit RC stuff and fly it. I sold out most my modelairplane stuff years back when we moved onto our sailboat so now I have to startcollecting all over and this time it will be real airplane stuff.Old memories are great but new challanges are even greater.GordonMike Cunningham wrote:> Hey Gordon, That's "Ambroid in the morning" if you are a real old timer!..> There is a pretty good test report on T-88 over on the Hatz website that you> might want to read. Mostly about gluing metal to metal and metal to wood,> but it has some good info. It seems to indicate that the bottom temp for> reliable curing is 35F. After reading everything I can find and using the> glue the general consensus is that if you get the mixture somewhere near> 50/50 , don't clamp it too tightly, and give it however much time is> required for it to cure at your tempurature, then you will get an airworthy> bond. I have been using the stuff to build my Hatz ribs in my model airplane> shop (in the house). If you already have a model airplane shop why would you> build your 1 to 1 scale Piet anywhere else? (I am still wondering if> I can get away with welding in the living room when the time comes).>> Mike> Hatz 710> -----Original Message-----
I remember Ambroid.I also remember when I got my allowance 50 cents I got Mom to take me to JiggsHobby shop and I had to go behind the counter as I could not see over it toselect my projects for the weekend. 2 comet stick airplanes 10 cents each and atube of glue. Used to get a good size tube for a dime. I would give almostanything to have some of them models now that I built. I still have about 60 oldnew in the box Top Flight props I bought in the 60's after getting out of theAir Force. Also sitting next to me as I just got it out of my treasure cabinetis a OK CUB Engine Accessory Kit. Has two wrenches, battery connector and asmall can of OK Cub Glow Fuel, still unopened. Cat No. 970 Cost $1.49I also have a NIB McCoy 40 RC Bluehead, maybe I will scale down a Piet and builda model RC, put in my old HeathKit RC stuff and fly it. I sold out most my modelairplane stuff years back when we moved onto our sailboat so now I have to startcollecting all over and this time it will be real airplane stuff.Old memories are great but new challanges are even greater.GordonMike Cunningham wrote:> Hey Gordon, That's "Ambroid in the morning" if you are a real old timer!..> There is a pretty good test report on T-88 over on the Hatz website that you> might want to read. Mostly about gluing metal to metal and metal to wood,> but it has some good info. It seems to indicate that the bottom temp for> reliable curing is 35F. After reading everything I can find and using the> glue the general consensus is that if you get the mixture somewhere near> 50/50 , don't clamp it too tightly, and give it however much time is> required for it to cure at your tempurature, then you will get an airworthy> bond. I have been using the stuff to build my Hatz ribs in my model airplane> shop (in the house). If you already have a model airplane shop why would you> build your 1 to 1 scale Piet anywhere else? (I am still wondering if> I can get away with welding in the living room when the time comes).>> Mike> Hatz 710> -----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Richard DeCosta
I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When Imoved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't changeanything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctant tomove my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on it less),but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wife andI were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes of effort..-CarmenRcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> > Larry,> It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the front door,> with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the house> uneffected.> > Chuck--________________________________________________________________________________
I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When Imoved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't changeanything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctant tomove my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on it less),but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wife andI were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes of effort..-CarmenRcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> > Larry,> It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the front door,> with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the house> uneffected.> > Chuck--________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Larry Pasley
What size table/bench is required to build the full size Piet?I'm planning on a level work bench of 4' x 16' using two pieces of 3/4" x 4' x8'Plywood built on sturdy legs and bolted to the wall.As long as I am going to add on to my workshed in the spring I want to make itlarge enough for the real piet that I will build later. I only figure 600 hrs forthe Ultralite Piet, BUt that could be wrong, book say 400 hrs so I added 200 more.Gordon"Mr. Carmen A. Natalie" wrote:> I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When I> moved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't change> anything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctant to> move my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on it less),> but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wife and> I were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes of effort..>> -Carmen>> Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> >> > Larry,> > It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the front door,> > with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the house> > uneffected.> >> > Chuck>> --________________________________________________________________________________
What size table/bench is required to build the full size Piet?I'm planning on a level work bench of 4' x 16' using two pieces of 3/4" x 4' x8'Plywood built on sturdy legs and bolted to the wall.As long as I am going to add on to my workshed in the spring I want to make itlarge enough for the real piet that I will build later. I only figure 600 hrs forthe Ultralite Piet, BUt that could be wrong, book say 400 hrs so I added 200 more.Gordon"Mr. Carmen A. Natalie" wrote:> I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When I> moved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't change> anything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctant to> move my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on it less),> but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wife and> I were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes of effort..>> -Carmen>> Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> >> > Larry,> > It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the front door,> > with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the house> > uneffected.> >> > Chuck>> --________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Larry Pasley
I agree with your statement. Work bench is an important item. When we had ourlast home I had a Bench/Cabinets built that were bullet proof, Bench was 18' x3' and 2" thick with a nice finish on it and bolted to the wall. Not big enoughfor an airplane but really nice for my reloading and other things I did backthen. Also had another smaller 10' x 3' that I used to beat/pound stuff on andit was really thick wood on top.EAA Chapter 1000 has plans for nice portable work benches that you can bolttogether to make larger benches/work areas.So Larry what size do you plan to make your work bench?GordonLarry Pasley wrote:> I may be in an overkill mode here, but when I start building, I plan to put> quite a lot of effort into the work table. I figure it is part of the gig> in many cases, and needs to be true. If it isn't, the part built will also> be off.> Thanks, Larry>> ----------> > What size table/bench is required to build the full size Piet?> >> > I'm planning on a level work bench of 4' x 16' using two pieces of 3/4" x> 4' x> > 8'> > Plywood built on sturdy legs and bolted to the wall.> >> > As long as I am going to add on to my workshed in the spring I want to> make it> > large enough for the real piet that I will build later. I only figure 600> hrs> > for> > the Ultralite Piet, BUt that could be wrong, book say 400 hrs so I added> 200> > more.> >> > Gordon> >> >> > "Mr. Carmen A. Natalie" wrote:> >> > > I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When I> > > moved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't change> > > anything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctant to> > > move my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on it less),> > > but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wife and> > > I were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes of effort..> > >> > > -Carmen> > >> > > Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> > > >> > > > Larry,> > > > It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the> front> > door,> > > > with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the house> > > > uneffected.> > > >> > > > Chuck> > >> > > --> >> >________________________________________________________________________________
I agree with your statement. Work bench is an important item. When we had ourlast home I had a Bench/Cabinets built that were bullet proof, Bench was 18' x3' and 2" thick with a nice finish on it and bolted to the wall. Not big enoughfor an airplane but really nice for my reloading and other things I did backthen. Also had another smaller 10' x 3' that I used to beat/pound stuff on andit was really thick wood on top.EAA Chapter 1000 has plans for nice portable work benches that you can bolttogether to make larger benches/work areas.So Larry what size do you plan to make your work bench?GordonLarry Pasley wrote:> I may be in an overkill mode here, but when I start building, I plan to put> quite a lot of effort into the work table. I figure it is part of the gig> in many cases, and needs to be true. If it isn't, the part built will also> be off.> Thanks, Larry>> ----------> > What size table/bench is required to build the full size Piet?> >> > I'm planning on a level work bench of 4' x 16' using two pieces of 3/4" x> 4' x> > 8'> > Plywood built on sturdy legs and bolted to the wall.> >> > As long as I am going to add on to my workshed in the spring I want to> make it> > large enough for the real piet that I will build later. I only figure 600> hrs> > for> > the Ultralite Piet, BUt that could be wrong, book say 400 hrs so I added> 200> > more.> >> > Gordon> >> >> > "Mr. Carmen A. Natalie" wrote:> >> > > I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When I> > > moved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't change> > > anything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctant to> > > move my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on it less),> > > but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wife and> > > I were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes of effort..> > >> > > -Carmen> > >> > > Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> > > >> > > > Larry,> > > > It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the> front> > door,> > > > with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the house> > > > uneffected.> > > >> > > > Chuck> > >> > > --> >> >________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
Hi Gordon: Couple of things that I considered when making my set up for the fuselage:itwasn't going to be here forever; I would want to have access from both sides fordetail work, so I looked at maximum fuselage depth & width and added 8 inches;love mymechanics adjustable roll around shop stool, so made fuselage set up table justtheright height for me to work comfortably from that. Does wonders for my back andmyattitude....{; )________________________________________________________________________________
Hi Gordon: Couple of things that I considered when making my set up for the fuselage:itwasn't going to be here forever; I would want to have access from both sides fordetail work, so I looked at maximum fuselage depth & width and added 8 inches;love mymechanics adjustable roll around shop stool, so made fuselage set up table justtheright height for me to work comfortably from that. Does wonders for my back andmyattitude....{; )________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Raffaele Bellissimo
I may be in an overkill mode here, but when I start building, I plan to putquite a lot of effort into the work table. I figure it is part of the gigin many cases, and needs to be true. If it isn't, the part built will alsobe off.Thanks, Larry > What size table/bench is required to build the full size Piet?> > I'm planning on a level work bench of 4' x 16' using two pieces of 3/4" x4' x> 8'> Plywood built on sturdy legs and bolted to the wall.> > As long as I am going to add on to my workshed in the spring I want tomake it> large enough for the real piet that I will build later. I only figure 600hrs> for> the Ultralite Piet, BUt that could be wrong, book say 400 hrs so I added200> more.> > Gordon> > > "Mr. Carmen A. Natalie" wrote:> > > I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When I> > moved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't change> > anything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctant to> > move my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on it less),> > but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wife and> > I were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes of effort..> >> > -Carmen> >> > Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> > >> > > Larry,> > > It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out thefront> door,> > > with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the house> > > uneffected.> > >> > > Chuck> >> > --> > ________________________________________________________________________________
I may be in an overkill mode here, but when I start building, I plan to putquite a lot of effort into the work table. I figure it is part of the gigin many cases, and needs to be true. If it isn't, the part built will alsobe off.Thanks, Larry > What size table/bench is required to build the full size Piet?> > I'm planning on a level work bench of 4' x 16' using two pieces of 3/4" x4' x> 8'> Plywood built on sturdy legs and bolted to the wall.> > As long as I am going to add on to my workshed in the spring I want tomake it> large enough for the real piet that I will build later. I only figure 600hrs> for> the Ultralite Piet, BUt that could be wrong, book say 400 hrs so I added200> more.> > Gordon> > > "Mr. Carmen A. Natalie" wrote:> > > I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When I> > moved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't change> > anything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctant to> > move my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on it less),> > but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wife and> > I were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes of effort..> >> > -Carmen> >> > Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> > >> > > Larry,> > > It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out thefront> door,> > > with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of the house> > > uneffected.> > >> > > Chuck> >> > --> > ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: "D.J.H."
Probably 2 ft. X 16 ft. with a threaded rod in the legs for adjustment.Support every 3 to 4 ft. Also have another work table that is about 3 ft. X6 ft. for alot of other work.> I agree with your statement. Work bench is an important item. When we hadour> last home I had a Bench/Cabinets built that were bullet proof, Bench was18' x> 3' and 2" thick with a nice finish on it and bolted to the wall. Not big> enough> for an airplane but really nice for my reloading and other things I didback> then. Also had another smaller 10' x 3' that I used to beat/pound stuffon and> it was really thick wood on top.> > EAA Chapter 1000 has plans for nice portable work benches that you canbolt> together to make larger benches/work areas.> > So Larry what size do you plan to make your work bench?> > Gordon> > > Larry Pasley wrote:> > > I may be in an overkill mode here, but when I start building, I plan toput> > quite a lot of effort into the work table. I figure it is part of thegig> > in many cases, and needs to be true. If it isn't, the part built willalso> > be off.> > Thanks, Larry> >> > ----------> > > What size table/bench is required to build the full size Piet?> > >> > > I'm planning on a level work bench of 4' x 16' using two pieces of3/4" x> > 4' x> > > 8'> > > Plywood built on sturdy legs and bolted to the wall.> > >> > > As long as I am going to add on to my workshed in the spring I want to> > make it> > > large enough for the real piet that I will build later. I only figure600> > hrs> > > for> > > the Ultralite Piet, BUt that could be wrong, book say 400 hrs so Iadded> > 200> > > more.> > >> > > Gordon> > >> > >> > > "Mr. Carmen A. Natalie" wrote:> > >> > > > I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When I> > > > moved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't change> > > > anything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctantto> > > > move my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on itless),> > > > but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wifeand> > > > I were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes ofeffort..> > > >> > > > -Carmen> > > >> > > > Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Larry,> > > > > It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the> > front> > > door,> > > > > with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of thehouse> > > > > uneffected.> > > > >> > > > > Chuck> > > >> > > > --> > >> > >> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Probably 2 ft. X 16 ft. with a threaded rod in the legs for adjustment.Support every 3 to 4 ft. Also have another work table that is about 3 ft. X6 ft. for alot of other work.> I agree with your statement. Work bench is an important item. When we hadour> last home I had a Bench/Cabinets built that were bullet proof, Bench was18' x> 3' and 2" thick with a nice finish on it and bolted to the wall. Not big> enough> for an airplane but really nice for my reloading and other things I didback> then. Also had another smaller 10' x 3' that I used to beat/pound stuffon and> it was really thick wood on top.> > EAA Chapter 1000 has plans for nice portable work benches that you canbolt> together to make larger benches/work areas.> > So Larry what size do you plan to make your work bench?> > Gordon> > > Larry Pasley wrote:> > > I may be in an overkill mode here, but when I start building, I plan toput> > quite a lot of effort into the work table. I figure it is part of thegig> > in many cases, and needs to be true. If it isn't, the part built willalso> > be off.> > Thanks, Larry> >> > ----------> > > What size table/bench is required to build the full size Piet?> > >> > > I'm planning on a level work bench of 4' x 16' using two pieces of3/4" x> > 4' x> > > 8'> > > Plywood built on sturdy legs and bolted to the wall.> > >> > > As long as I am going to add on to my workshed in the spring I want to> > make it> > > large enough for the real piet that I will build later. I only figure600> > hrs> > > for> > > the Ultralite Piet, BUt that could be wrong, book say 400 hrs so Iadded> > 200> > > more.> > >> > > Gordon> > >> > >> > > "Mr. Carmen A. Natalie" wrote:> > >> > > > I built my fuselage in my livingroom (prior to my marriage...). When I> > > > moved the raw materials in, I saw that as long as I didn't change> > > > anything, the fuselage would go out the same way. I was reluctantto> > > > move my project into the workshop, (and as a result, I work on itless),> > > > but sometimes domestic harmony has to take precedent... My wifeand> > > > I were able to move the fuselage out in only a few minutes ofeffort..> > > >> > > > -Carmen> > > >> > > > Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Larry,> > > > > It looks as though I will be able to carry the wing right out the> > front> > > door,> > > > > with the help of 3 or 4 friends, and leave the structure of thehouse> > > > > uneffected.> > > > >> > > > > Chuck> > > >> > > > --> > >> > >> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By:> Warren Shoun
You need access from both sides while working on the fuselage, tailfeathers. etc. I used two 4x8 tables with adjustable legs for leveling,and bolted together. You can layout full size plans for fuselage, ribs,and tail surfaces. Then build just like the old stick models.
You need access from both sides while working on the fuselage, tailfeathers. etc. I used two 4x8 tables with adjustable legs for leveling,and bolted together. You can layout full size plans for fuselage, ribs,and tail surfaces. Then build just like the old stick models.
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By:> > Warren Shoun
Entill I add on to my metal workshop or add a roof to my patio I am stuckwith a 10'x12.5' metal building to do my building right now. I will be justmaking my wing ribs and other small parts at first I guess. Spring will seethe add on for sure.Thanks for your information guys.Yes, just a large model airplane. I see giant scale RC models now with 132"wing spans J-3 CubGordonPhil Phillips wrote:> You need access from both sides while working on the fuselage, tail> feathers. etc. I used two 4x8 tables with adjustable legs for leveling,> and bolted together. You can layout full size plans for fuselage, ribs,> and tail surfaces. Then build just like the old stick models.>> ----------
Entill I add on to my metal workshop or add a roof to my patio I am stuckwith a 10'x12.5' metal building to do my building right now. I will be justmaking my wing ribs and other small parts at first I guess. Spring will seethe add on for sure.Thanks for your information guys.Yes, just a large model airplane. I see giant scale RC models now with 132"wing spans J-3 CubGordonPhil Phillips wrote:> You need access from both sides while working on the fuselage, tail> feathers. etc. I used two 4x8 tables with adjustable legs for leveling,> and bolted together. You can layout full size plans for fuselage, ribs,> and tail surfaces. Then build just like the old stick models.>> ----------
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: David Schober
>Mike,>I'll keep the sawdust out in the garage. It is great to have a heatedarea to>build in, and all the other stuff ya mentioned, as I did all the ribs, and>fiberglass fuel tank in the dining room. >Did you use an adjustable rear strut fork end?>>ChuckChuck- I used adjustable fork ends on all four struts- this way I couldadjust for diehedral and washout. I got a used set and had themmagnafluxed before installing them. ________________________________________________________________________________
>Mike,>I'll keep the sawdust out in the garage. It is great to have a heatedarea to>build in, and all the other stuff ya mentioned, as I did all the ribs, and>fiberglass fuel tank in the dining room. >Did you use an adjustable rear strut fork end?>>ChuckChuck- I used adjustable fork ends on all four struts- this way I couldadjust for diehedral and washout. I got a used set and had themmagnafluxed before installing them. ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Mike Cunningham
Thanks Mike, Stevee also posted this, and I found a ton of interesting and useful"stuff" there and on the attached links, and plan to go back and cruise aroundsome more info. Thanks again.Warren________________________________________________________________________________
Thanks Mike, Stevee also posted this, and I found a ton of interesting and useful"stuff" there and on the attached links, and plan to go back and cruise aroundsome more info. Thanks again.Warren________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By:> Gordon Brimhall
Started building model airplanes around 1949 and shortly after that was flyingControline and free flight. By 1965 I was out of the Air Force and was a modelmaker & designer for Riggen Industries (Slot Cars & RC Bodies ProductionTooling) I've made well over 200 Vacuum Form molds. Got into RC about 1968 ButI never got real good at flying as we had to drive too far to find a place tofly. Then with 8 - 10 yrs as a Aircraft and Marine Machinist I have just enoughskills to build an airplane, Just getting Old N Slow.I like to build things more than anything else.GordonMike Cunningham wrote:> Sounds like you go back further than me in the model airplane biz!. I have> only been at it since age eight, that was 1965. There are plenty of good RC> Piet plans available. I think RC modeler has a 1/4 Scale Air Camper. Most> other plans are for Scouts.> -----Original Message-----
Started building model airplanes around 1949 and shortly after that was flyingControline and free flight. By 1965 I was out of the Air Force and was a modelmaker & designer for Riggen Industries (Slot Cars & RC Bodies ProductionTooling) I've made well over 200 Vacuum Form molds. Got into RC about 1968 ButI never got real good at flying as we had to drive too far to find a place tofly. Then with 8 - 10 yrs as a Aircraft and Marine Machinist I have just enoughskills to build an airplane, Just getting Old N Slow.I like to build things more than anything else.GordonMike Cunningham wrote:> Sounds like you go back further than me in the model airplane biz!. I have> only been at it since age eight, that was 1965. There are plenty of good RC> Piet plans available. I think RC modeler has a 1/4 Scale Air Camper. Most> other plans are for Scouts.> -----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Warren Shoun
The Hatz website is weebeastie.com/hatzcb1/htm-----Original Message-----
The Hatz website is weebeastie.com/hatzcb1/htm-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
Sounds like you go back further than me in the model airplane biz!. I haveonly been at it since age eight, that was 1965. There are plenty of good RCPiet plans available. I think RC modeler has a 1/4 Scale Air Camper. Mostother plans are for Scouts.-----Original Message-----
Sounds like you go back further than me in the model airplane biz!. I haveonly been at it since age eight, that was 1965. There are plenty of good RCPiet plans available. I think RC modeler has a 1/4 Scale Air Camper. Mostother plans are for Scouts.-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Joe & Marian Beck
Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov (Michael D Cuy) wrote:Chuck- I used adjustable fork ends on all four struts- this way I couldadjust for dihedral and washout. I got a used set and had themmagnafluxed before installing them. Mike, Are these fork ends aircraft hardware? Cast aluminum, or magnesium? How muchexperimenting have ya done with the adjustments on 'em? How much TT do yahave on your 632 lb. Piet? How did ya keep the weight so low ? It's thelightest one I've heard of, especially with brakes, and a tail wheel. Areyour wing struts extruded aluminum? Dija ever build those skis?I'm driving home for Christmas, along RT. 70, to Wheeling, and I was wonderingif I could stop in and see your plane on my way back. Just a thought. Isthere anyone else that is close to the path I'm taking? (Rt. 70)Chuck"Man is made for error; it enters his mind naturally and he discovers a fewtruths only with the greatest effort." ~~ Fredrick the Great ~~________________________________________________________________________________
Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov (Michael D Cuy) wrote:Chuck- I used adjustable fork ends on all four struts- this way I couldadjust for dihedral and washout. I got a used set and had themmagnafluxed before installing them. Mike, Are these fork ends aircraft hardware? Cast aluminum, or magnesium? How muchexperimenting have ya done with the adjustments on 'em? How much TT do yahave on your 632 lb. Piet? How did ya keep the weight so low ? It's thelightest one I've heard of, especially with brakes, and a tail wheel. Areyour wing struts extruded aluminum? Dija ever build those skis?I'm driving home for Christmas, along RT. 70, to Wheeling, and I was wonderingif I could stop in and see your plane on my way back. Just a thought. Isthere anyone else that is close to the path I'm taking? (Rt. 70)Chuck"Man is made for error; it enters his mind naturally and he discovers a fewtruths only with the greatest effort." ~~ Fredrick the Great ~~________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Michael Brusilow
>Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov (Michael D Cuy) wrote:>Chuck- I used adjustable fork ends on all four struts- this way I could>adjust for dihedral and washout. I got a used set and had them>magnafluxed before installing them. >>Mike, >Are these fork ends aircraft hardware? Cast aluminum, or magnesium?0000,8080,8080The forks I used were AN aircrafthardware- I'm assuming 4130chromolly steel. They were from a set of J-3 Cub struts.w How much>experimenting have ya done with the adjustments on 'em? 0000,8080,8080Actually I adjusted them severaltimes during the first 10 hoursof flying time to get my Piet to fly hands off and to adjust the dihedral. I had too much dihedral at first and I just didn't likethe looks of it, but yet didn't want to have the flat wing.(ever seen a bird with flat wings ?) It does fly nicer hands offwith 1-2 degrees of dihedral than flat. (more stable for youto fold charts, put your gloves on, etc.) How much TT do ya>have on your 632 lb. Piet? 0000,8080,808097hours. How did ya keep the weight so low ? It's the>lightest one I've heard of, especially with brakes, and a tail wheel.0000,8080,8080I stuck to the plans. (mostly) I've seen alot of builders who thinkthey are doing themselves good by 'beefing' up parts of theirproject when if fact they are only adding unecessary ballast. Yes, Iagree, the tail surfaces seem cheezy, some other parts look weak, but guess what ? It's been doing it for almost 70 years-noproblemo. 0000,8080,8080Oh- one otherthing: I used the light grade dacron and dope. No need to use the heavier fabrics on your Piet unless you plan on itbeing outside or operating off of rugged strips. This saved a ton ofweight..Are your wing struts extruded aluminum?0000,8080,8080I used (ouch $) 4130streamlined chromolly stock from Dillsburg (PA) Aeroworks.Brand new, big bucks, but I sleep pretty good at night or when I'm taking someone's Father, brother, or Mother for a ride. Dija ever build those skis?0000,8080,8080Not yet, but it's still on Santa'slist !>I'm driving home for Christmas, along RT. 70, to Wheeling, and Iwas wondering>if I could stop in and see your plane on my way back. Just a thought. Is>there anyone else that is close to the path I'm taking? (Rt. 70)>>Chuck0000,8080,8080 Sure ! I'm about 2 hoursnorth of Route 70, well make that2.5 I guess from Columbus. I71 North to Route 303 Brunswickexit. Go 15 min. thru Valley City, 7720 Center Road. (CenterRoad = Route 303)Merry Christmas !!!>>"Man is made for error; it enters his mind naturally and he discovers afew>truths only with the greatest effort." ~~ Fredrick the Great ~~>>________________________________________________________________________________
>Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov (Michael D Cuy) wrote:>Chuck- I used adjustable fork ends on all four struts- this way I could>adjust for dihedral and washout. I got a used set and had them>magnafluxed before installing them. >>Mike, >Are these fork ends aircraft hardware? Cast aluminum, or magnesium?0000,8080,8080The forks I used were AN aircrafthardware- I'm assuming 4130chromolly steel. They were from a set of J-3 Cub struts.w How much>experimenting have ya done with the adjustments on 'em? 0000,8080,8080Actually I adjusted them severaltimes during the first 10 hoursof flying time to get my Piet to fly hands off and to adjust the dihedral. I had too much dihedral at first and I just didn't likethe looks of it, but yet didn't want to have the flat wing.(ever seen a bird with flat wings ?) It does fly nicer hands offwith 1-2 degrees of dihedral than flat. (more stable for youto fold charts, put your gloves on, etc.) How much TT do ya>have on your 632 lb. Piet? 0000,8080,808097hours. How did ya keep the weight so low ? It's the>lightest one I've heard of, especially with brakes, and a tail wheel.0000,8080,8080I stuck to the plans. (mostly) I've seen alot of builders who thinkthey are doing themselves good by 'beefing' up parts of theirproject when if fact they are only adding unecessary ballast. Yes, Iagree, the tail surfaces seem cheezy, some other parts look weak, but guess what ? It's been doing it for almost 70 years-noproblemo. 0000,8080,8080Oh- one otherthing: I used the light grade dacron and dope. No need to use the heavier fabrics on your Piet unless you plan on itbeing outside or operating off of rugged strips. This saved a ton ofweight..Are your wing struts extruded aluminum?0000,8080,8080I used (ouch $) 4130streamlined chromolly stock from Dillsburg (PA) Aeroworks.Brand new, big bucks, but I sleep pretty good at night or when I'm taking someone's Father, brother, or Mother for a ride. Dija ever build those skis?0000,8080,8080Not yet, but it's still on Santa'slist !>I'm driving home for Christmas, along RT. 70, to Wheeling, and Iwas wondering>if I could stop in and see your plane on my way back. Just a thought. Is>there anyone else that is close to the path I'm taking? (Rt. 70)>>Chuck0000,8080,8080 Sure ! I'm about 2 hoursnorth of Route 70, well make that2.5 I guess from Columbus. I71 North to Route 303 Brunswickexit. Go 15 min. thru Valley City, 7720 Center Road. (CenterRoad = Route 303)Merry Christmas !!!>>"Man is made for error; it enters his mind naturally and he discovers afew>truths only with the greatest effort." ~~ Fredrick the Great ~~>>________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Raffaele Bellissimo
Mike,Thanks for the info. My Pietenpol partner, Doug Bryant, said he saw yourplane in Oshkosh, and told me ya won an award for plans built plane.Congratulations !! I'll let ya know if I can stop in, on my flip-flop fromWheeling. I would love to stop in, but I think I'll be pressed for time. Chuck________________________________________________________________________________
Mike,Thanks for the info. My Pietenpol partner, Doug Bryant, said he saw yourplane in Oshkosh, and told me ya won an award for plans built plane.Congratulations !! I'll let ya know if I can stop in, on my flip-flop fromWheeling. I would love to stop in, but I think I'll be pressed for time. Chuck________________________________________________________________________________
> Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: "Mr. Carmen A. Natalie"
> Subject: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>> >> >> >Michael D Cuy wrote:> >> >> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could> explode in> >> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3> piece> >> >wing.> >> >> >> >Gordon> >>> >> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car> garage.> >> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car> >> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards> >> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against> >> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the> >> morning.> >>> >> MC> >> >I still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88 is> no> >worse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in the morning> too.> >> >Gordon> >> >> >________________________________________________________________________________
> Subject: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>> >> >> >Michael D Cuy wrote:> >> >> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could> explode in> >> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3> piece> >> >wing.> >> >> >> >Gordon> >>> >> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car> garage.> >> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car> >> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards> >> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against> >> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the> >> morning.> >>> >> MC> >> >I still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88 is> no> >worse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in the morning> too.> >> >Gordon> >> >> >________________________________________________________________________________
> Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Ian Holland
> > Hi Gordon:> Couple of things that I considered when making my set up for thefuselage: it> wasn't going to be here forever; I would want to have access from bothsides for> detail work, so I looked at maximum fuselage depth & width and added 8inches; ________________________________________________________________________________
> > Hi Gordon:> Couple of things that I considered when making my set up for thefuselage: it> wasn't going to be here forever; I would want to have access from bothsides for> detail work, so I looked at maximum fuselage depth & width and added 8inches; ________________________________________________________________________________
> > Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: Dave and Connie
> >> > Hi Gordon:> > Couple of things that I considered when making my set up for the> fuselage: it> > wasn't going to be here forever; I would want to have access from both> sides for> > detail work, so I looked at maximum fuselage depth & width and added 8> inches;________________________________________________________________________________
> >> > Hi Gordon:> > Couple of things that I considered when making my set up for the> fuselage: it> > wasn't going to be here forever; I would want to have access from both> sides for> > detail work, so I looked at maximum fuselage depth & width and added 8> inches;________________________________________________________________________________
>> Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: jmcnarry(at)techplus.com (John McNarry)
>> Subject: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>>>> >>> >>> >Michael D Cuy wrote:>> >>> >> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could>> explode in>> >> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3>> piece>> >> >wing.>> >> >>> >> >Gordon>> >>>> >> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car>> garage.>> >> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car>> >> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards>> >> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against>> >> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the>> >> morning.>> >>>> >> MC>> >>> >I still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88is>> no>> >worse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in themorning>> too.>> >>> >Gordon>> >>> >>> >>________________________________________________________________________________
>> Subject: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>>>> >>> >>> >Michael D Cuy wrote:>> >>> >> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could>> explode in>> >> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3>> piece>> >> >wing.>> >> >>> >> >Gordon>> >>>> >> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car>> garage.>> >> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car>> >> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards>> >> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against>> >> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the>> >> morning.>> >>>> >> MC>> >>> >I still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88is>> no>> >worse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in themorning>> too.>> >>> >Gordon>> >>> >>> >>________________________________________________________________________________
> Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By:> >> Gordon Brimhall
> Subject: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>> >I remember Ambroid.> >> >I also remember when I got my allowance 50 cents I got Mom to take me to> Jiggs> >Hobby shop and I had to go behind the counter as I could not see over it to> >select my projects for the weekend. 2 comet stick airplanes 10 cents each> and a> >tube of glue. Used to get a good size tube for a dime. I would give almost> >anything to have some of them models now that I built. I still have about> 60 old> >new in the box Top Flight props I bought in the 60's after getting out of> the> >Air Force. Also sitting next to me as I just got it out of my treasure> cabinet> >is a OK CUB Engine Accessory Kit. Has two wrenches, battery connector and a> >small can of OK Cub Glow Fuel, still unopened. Cat No. 970 Cost $1.49> >> >I also have a NIB McCoy 40 RC Bluehead, maybe I will scale down a Piet and> build> >a model RC, put in my old HeathKit RC stuff and fly it. I sold out most my> model> >airplane stuff years back when we moved onto our sailboat so now I have to> start> >collecting all over and this time it will be real airplane stuff.> >> >Old memories are great but new challanges are even greater.> >> >Gordon> >> >> >Mike Cunningham wrote:> >> >> Hey Gordon, That's "Ambroid in the morning" if you are a real old> timer!..> >> There is a pretty good test report on T-88 over on the Hatz website that> you> >> might want to read. Mostly about gluing metal to metal and metal to wood,> >> but it has some good info. It seems to indicate that the bottom temp for> >> reliable curing is 35F. After reading everything I can find and using the> >> glue the general consensus is that if you get the mixture somewhere near> >> 50/50 , don't clamp it too tightly, and give it however much time is> >> required for it to cure at your tempurature, then you will get an> airworthy> >> bond. I have been using the stuff to build my Hatz ribs in my model> airplane> >> shop (in the house). If you already have a model airplane shop why would> you> >> build your 1 to 1 scale Piet anywhere else? (I am still wondering if> >> I can get away with welding in the living room when the time comes).> >>> >> Mike> >> Hatz 710> >> -----Original Message-----
> Subject: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)>> >I remember Ambroid.> >> >I also remember when I got my allowance 50 cents I got Mom to take me to> Jiggs> >Hobby shop and I had to go behind the counter as I could not see over it to> >select my projects for the weekend. 2 comet stick airplanes 10 cents each> and a> >tube of glue. Used to get a good size tube for a dime. I would give almost> >anything to have some of them models now that I built. I still have about> 60 old> >new in the box Top Flight props I bought in the 60's after getting out of> the> >Air Force. Also sitting next to me as I just got it out of my treasure> cabinet> >is a OK CUB Engine Accessory Kit. Has two wrenches, battery connector and a> >small can of OK Cub Glow Fuel, still unopened. Cat No. 970 Cost $1.49> >> >I also have a NIB McCoy 40 RC Bluehead, maybe I will scale down a Piet and> build> >a model RC, put in my old HeathKit RC stuff and fly it. I sold out most my> model> >airplane stuff years back when we moved onto our sailboat so now I have to> start> >collecting all over and this time it will be real airplane stuff.> >> >Old memories are great but new challanges are even greater.> >> >Gordon> >> >> >Mike Cunningham wrote:> >> >> Hey Gordon, That's "Ambroid in the morning" if you are a real old> timer!..> >> There is a pretty good test report on T-88 over on the Hatz website that> you> >> might want to read. Mostly about gluing metal to metal and metal to wood,> >> but it has some good info. It seems to indicate that the bottom temp for> >> reliable curing is 35F. After reading everything I can find and using the> >> glue the general consensus is that if you get the mixture somewhere near> >> 50/50 , don't clamp it too tightly, and give it however much time is> >> required for it to cure at your tempurature, then you will get an> airworthy> >> bond. I have been using the stuff to build my Hatz ribs in my model> airplane> >> shop (in the house). If you already have a model airplane shop why would> you> >> build your 1 to 1 scale Piet anywhere else? (I am still wondering if> >> I can get away with welding in the living room when the time comes).> >>> >> Mike> >> Hatz 710> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> Re: wing construction (on L.E.)
Original Posted By: ADonJr(at)aol.com
> >> Subject: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >Michael D Cuy wrote:> >> >> >> >> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could> >> explode in> >> >> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3> >> piece> >> >> >wing.> >> >> >> >> >> >Gordon> >> >>> >> >> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car> >> garage.> >> >> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car> >> >> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards> >> >> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against> >> >> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the> >> >> morning.> >> >>> >> >> MC> >> >> >> >I still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88> is> >> no> >> >worse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in the> morning> >> too.> >> >> >> >Gordon> >> >> >> >> >> >> >________________________________________________________________________________
> >> Subject: Re: wing construction (on L.E.)> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >Michael D Cuy wrote:> >> >> >> >> >So what kind of glue was you using, I worry about fumes that could> >> explode in> >> >> >the house. How large of an area do you need if you are building the 3> >> piece> >> >> >wing.> >> >> >> >> >> >Gordon> >> >>> >> >> Steve E. and I can both testify that a Piet can be built in a one car> >> garage.> >> >> I stored my completed Piet unassembled with 3 pce. wing in a one car> >> >> garage. I used T-88 epoxy and had no problems with any hazards> >> >> besides wearing surgical gloves once in a while to guard against> >> >> allergic skin reactions. Ah, the smell of T-88 and spruce in the> >> >> morning.> >> >>> >> >> MC> >> >> >> >I still build models with model airplane cement in the house, so if T-88> is> >> no> >> >worse I won't mind. Nothing like the smell of testers dope in the> morning> >> too.> >> >> >> >Gordon> >> >> >> >> >> >> >________________________________________________________________________________