Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Mon Sep 13, 1999 9:09 pm

Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>OK, I didn't say it was PERFECT

. Besides, if you were to build a>homebuilt version, you could fix a lot of that

.>>On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything>about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth? More specifically, does anyone know where>to get plans for such a plane? I know, they are a production plane, but>with many of them being restored in museums, someone must have access to>the blueprints or structural drawings. This is my all time favorite plane>and I would love to build a 100 % replica of teh bird. Construction on the>versions I've seen doesn't appear difficult and looks like it could easily>be reprodiced by someone with some engineering and homebuilding>experience, ie. ME.>>I could see using one of the new Walter Lom 4 cylinder, inverted, inline>engines for power. They would fit nicely under that cowl. Basic structural>plans would be a good start. Wing rib layouts and spar details would be>useful as well. Control and fitting diagrams would be good, but not a>necessity. After all, most of the controls run outside the plane

.>Given an empty weight of around 1100 lbs, there is not a lot more to a>Tiger Moth than there is in a Citabria/Super Cub.>>Any ideas would be appreciated.>>Ken>>> Surley I jest about these points, heck anything that flies>> interests me...just some more than others.>> Common down Ken, we'll go fly the Cub around for a while !!>>>>>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>Calgary, Alberta, Canada>Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Sep 14, 1999 12:20 am

Original Posted By: walter evans
Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth Ken Beanlands wrote: On a completely different subject, does anyone out there knowanything about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth? for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tomselleck movie, I think it was called "high road to china" regards JoeC Zion, Illinois________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Sep 14, 1999 7:32 am

Original Posted By: Matt Kirk
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>OK, I didn't say it was PERFECT

. Besides, if you were to build a>homebuilt version, you could fix a lot of that

.>>On a completely different subject, does anyone out there knowanything>about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth? More specifically, does anyone knowwhere>to get plans for such a plane? I know, they are a production plane,but>with many of them being restored in museums, someone must have accessto>the blueprints or structural drawings. This is my all time favoriteplane>and I would love to build a 100 % replica of teh bird. Constructionon the>versions I've seen doesn't appear difficult and looks like it couldeasily>be reprodiced by someone with some engineering and homebuilding>experience, ie. ME.>>I could see using one of the new Walter Lom 4 cylinder, inverted,inline>engines for power. They would fit nicely under that cowl. Basicstructural>plans would be a good start. Wing rib layouts and spar details wouldbe>useful as well. Control and fitting diagrams would be good, but not a>necessity. After all, most of the controls run outside the plane

.>Given an empty weight of around 1100 lbs, there is not a lot more toa>Tiger Moth than there is in a Citabria/Super Cub.>>Any ideas would be appreciated.>>Ken>>> Surley I jest about these points, heck anything that flies>> interests me...just some more than others.>> Common down Ken, we'll go fly the Cub around for a while !!>>>>>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>Calgary, Alberta, Canada>Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Sep 14, 1999 2:29 pm

Original Posted By: fishin
OK, I didn't say it was PERFECT

. Besides, if you were to build ahomebuilt version, you could fix a lot of that

.On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anythingabout the old DH-82 Tiger Moth? More specifically, does anyone know whereto get plans for such a plane? I know, they are a production plane, butwith many of them being restored in museums, someone must have access tothe blueprints or structural drawings. This is my all time favorite planeand I would love to build a 100 % replica of teh bird. Construction on theversions I've seen doesn't appear difficult and looks like it could easilybe reprodiced by someone with some engineering and homebuildingexperience, ie. ME.I could see using one of the new Walter Lom 4 cylinder, inverted, inlineengines for power. They would fit nicely under that cowl. Basic structuralplans would be a good start. Wing rib layouts and spar details would beuseful as well. Control and fitting diagrams would be good, but not anecessity. After all, most of the controls run outside the plane

.Given an empty weight of around 1100 lbs, there is not a lot more to aTiger Moth than there is in a Citabria/Super Cub.Any ideas would be appreciated.Ken> Surley I jest about these points, heck anything that flies> interests me...just some more than others. > Common down Ken, we'll go fly the Cub around for a while !!> Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)Calgary, Alberta, CanadaChristavia MK 1 C-GREN________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Sep 14, 1999 4:19 pm

Original Posted By: BARNSTMR(at)aol.com
Ken Beanlands wrote:>>> On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything> about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tom selleckmovie,I think it was called "high road to china"regardsJoeCZion, IllinoisKen Beanlands wrote:On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anythingabout the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tom selleckmovie,I think it was called "high road to china"regardsJoeCZion, Illinois________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Sep 14, 1999 4:44 pm

Original Posted By: BARNSTMR(at)aol.com
Close, but that was a Stampe. Three of them, actually. That movie is partof my home collection.Ken.On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:> > > Ken Beanlands wrote:> > >> >> > On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything> > about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?> > for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tom selleck> movie,> I think it was called "high road to china"> regards> JoeC> Zion, Illinois> Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)Calgary, Alberta, CanadaChristavia MK 1 C-GREN________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Sep 14, 1999 6:36 pm

Original Posted By: fishin
Theres a fellow about 8 mi. from me with his own field, who has a TigerMoth ( and a J3 lookalike U/L) He has a Tiger Moth flyin every year forall the other ones.waltNorthern NJ -----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Tue Sep 14, 1999 7:50 pm

Original Posted By: Chris Coates
oh well,,,they were just as purty and the flying scenes made you wish it wasyou in the cockpitJoeCKen Beanlands wrote:> Close, but that was a Stampe. Three of them, actually. That movie is part> of my home collection.>> Ken.>> On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:>> >> >> > Ken Beanlands wrote:> >> > >> > >> > > On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything> > > about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?> >> > for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tom selleck> > movie,> > I think it was called "high road to china"> > regards> > JoeC> > Zion, Illinois> >>> Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> Calgary, Alberta, Canada> Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> oh well,,,they were just as purty and the flying scenes made you wishit was you in the cockpitJoeCKen Beanlands wrote:Close, but that was a Stampe. Three of them, actually.That movie is partof my home collection.Ken.On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:>>> Ken Beanlands wrote:>> >> >> > On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything> > about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?>> for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tomselleck> movie,> I think it was called "high road to china"> regards> JoeC> Zion, Illinois>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)Calgary, Alberta, CanadaChristavia MK 1 C-GRENhttp://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>_____________ ... __________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 12:03 am

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
There is a set of plans for a replica Tiger Moth available fromsomeone out there, but I forget just who..... I believe they areavailable from a Canadian outfit. Aerocrafter .... an EAA publicationprobably lists it. The web site for EAA is www.eaa.org and I believethere is an Aerocrafter page or group of pages there. The publicationcosts $ 29.00 and lists according to their information 750 aircraftplans and kits. EAA information services will probably come up withthe desired info if you post a request.... they always reply withprompt accurate information to any request.H.W.-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 2:34 am

Original Posted By: LaurenMWilliams(at)webtv.net (Lauren Williams)
Subject: Pietenpol-List: center section cabane strut brackets:The plans for the upper cabane spar fittings as "U" channel made of 3/4X .90 strap, with 2 tab's welded below for the top of the cabane strut.Several people are telling that is wrong. Need to be 2 "U" channelswelded together at crotch, one facing up the other down. What have youother builders done? Leon S.________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 3:02 am

Original Posted By: jmcnarry(at)techplus.com (John McNarry)
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>Ken, you may want to contact the Empire Training museum in Brandon,>Manitoba. I believe tyhat they have (had) one, and also had the plans.>----- Original Message ----->From: Ken Beanlands >To: Pietenpol Discussion >Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 1999 6:45 PM>Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>>>> I've also been following the Hatz pages quite closely. It's certainly a>> nice machine. However, the useful load is not as good with the Hatz and>> eventually, I'd like to have something to put on floats. The Tiger Moth>> makes a beutiful floatplane with about 650 lbs of useful load left over,>> even on floats. My idea would be to put the greenhouse on it similar to>> the Canadian trainer version.>>>> Maybe it's a pipe dream, but I have been able to shake down a couple of>> leads. One of the Flying Farmers here in Alberta has one and may have>> drawings.>>>> Ken>>>> On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 RPas909040(at)aol.com wrote:>>>> > If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane (with a steel>tube>> > fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If you need>more>> > details I can supply them.>> >>> > Rob Passley>> > NX338RP Hatz (in work)>> > NX899R Pietenpol (in work)>> >>>>> Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>> Calgary, Alberta, Canada>> Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>> >>>>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 3:46 am

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth Thanks for the info guys. Speaking of Hatz, a guy has one for saleabout 60 miles from me for $13,000. According to a Hatz specialist inSeguin, Texas (Forget his name athe the present time, but he has been inKitplanes and other publications), it's an absolute steal. Needs someTLC however, and currently i don't have the time for a "project". Robert (Still enjoying my ol GN-1) Hensarling robert hensarling wrote: -----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 4:25 am

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger MothI also love that movie (and Bess Armstrong) because of the planes, vintagecloths, etc. I have to ask though, exactly what is a stamp? Company thatmade it? Years made? Country made, etc. Since this isn't Pietenpolrelated, direct email is fine.>The last 5 minutes of the movie, during the credits, is nothing but the>Stampe flying a graceful aerobatic routine. Wonderful movie.>>Ken>>On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:>>> oh well,,,they were just as purty and the flying scenes made you wish itwas>> you in the cockpit>> JoeC>>>> Ken Beanlands wrote:>>>> > Close, but that was a Stampe. Three of them, actually. That movie ispart>> > of my home collection.>> >>> > Ken.>> >>> > On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:>> >>> > >>> > >>> > > Ken Beanlands wrote:>> > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > > On a completely different subject, does anyone out there knowanything>> > > > about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?>> > >>> > > for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tomselleck>> > > movie,>> > > I think it was called "high road to china">> > > regards>> > > JoeC>> > > Zion, Illinois>> > >>> >>> > Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>> > Calgary, Alberta, Canada>> > Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>> > >>>>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>Calgary, Alberta, Canada>Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 4:25 am

Original Posted By: Ian Holland
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger MothI also love that movie (and Bess Armstrong) because of the planes, vintagecloths, etc. I have to ask though, exactly what is a stamp?Company thatmade it? Years made? Country made, etc.Stampe J series, Belgium, 1918/1933 100hp hall-scott engineStampe SV4 1933, 130hp deHavilland GipsyMajor enginemilitary trainersSV4B France 140hp Renault engineJoeC________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 4:25 am

Original Posted By: COZYPILOT(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth I also love that movie (and Bess Armstrong) because of theplanes, vintage cloths, etc. I have to ask though, exactly what is a stamp? Company that made it? Years made? Country made, etc. Stampe J series, Belgium, 1918/1933 100hp hall-scott engine Stampe SV4 1933, 130hp deHavilland Gipsy Major engine military trainers SV4B France 140hp Renault engine JoeC________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 7:44 am

Original Posted By: walter evans
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>The replica I've seen, I looked at at Oshkosh this year was from Fisher>Flying Products .>They have the R-80 Tiger Moth. If I was going to build a biplane thatwould>probably be the one.>It's a replica of the DeHaviland DH82A Tiger Moth at 80% scale. They also>have quick build kits??? What's that???>I thought that was when your wood didn't have bark on it....>>Greg Yotz>>>-----Original Message----->From: Ken Beanlands >To: Pietenpol Discussion >Date: Tuesday, September 14, 1999 2:09 PM>Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>>>>OK, I didn't say it was PERFECT

. Besides, if you were to build a>>homebuilt version, you could fix a lot of that

.>>>>On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything>>about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth? More specifically, does anyone know where>>to get plans for such a plane? I know, they are a production plane, but>>with many of them being restored in museums, someone must have access to>>the blueprints or structural drawings. This is my all time favorite plane>>and I would love to build a 100 % replica of teh bird. Construction on the>>versions I've seen doesn't appear difficult and looks like it could easily>>be reprodiced by someone with some engineering and homebuilding>>experience, ie. ME.>>>>I could see using one of the new Walter Lom 4 cylinder, inverted, inline>>engines for power. They would fit nicely under that cowl. Basic structural>>plans would be a good start. Wing rib layouts and spar details would be>>useful as well. Control and fitting diagrams would be good, but not a>>necessity. After all, most of the controls run outside the plane

.>>Given an empty weight of around 1100 lbs, there is not a lot more to a>>Tiger Moth than there is in a Citabria/Super Cub.>>>>Any ideas would be appreciated.>>>>Ken>>>>> Surley I jest about these points, heck anything that flies>>> interests me...just some more than others.>>> Common down Ken, we'll go fly the Cub around for a while !!>>>>>>>>>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>>Calgary, Alberta, Canada>>Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>>>>>>>>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 8:56 am

Original Posted By: kayak(at)zebra.net (Robert C. Fawcett)
The last 5 minutes of the movie, during the credits, is nothing but theStampe flying a graceful aerobatic routine. Wonderful movie.KenOn Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:> oh well,,,they were just as purty and the flying scenes made you wish it was> you in the cockpit> JoeC> > Ken Beanlands wrote:> > > Close, but that was a Stampe. Three of them, actually. That movie is part> > of my home collection.> >> > Ken.> >> > On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:> >> > >> > >> > > Ken Beanlands wrote:> > >> > > >> > > >> > > > On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything> > > > about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?> > >> > > for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tom selleck> > > movie,> > > I think it was called "high road to china"> > > regards> > > JoeC> > > Zion, Illinois> > >> >> > Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> > Calgary, Alberta, Canada> > Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> > > Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)Calgary, Alberta, CanadaChristavia MK 1 C-GREN________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 9:19 am

Original Posted By: John Duprey
I love that movie, it is in my collection as well, But the flying sceneswere INCREDIBLE on the big screen in the theaters. I always wonderd whatkind of planes they were, I was pretty shure the were'nt Moths. Justremember as your Piet projects slowly emerge from the wood pile, "The oxis slow, but the earth is patient" (LOL).John DupreyKen Beanlands wrote:> > The last 5 minutes of the movie, during the credits, is nothing but the> Stampe flying a graceful aerobatic routine. Wonderful movie.> > Ken> > On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:> > > oh well,,,they were just as purty and the flying scenes made you wish it was> > you in the cockpit> > JoeC> >> > Ken Beanlands wrote:> >> > > Close, but that was a Stampe. Three of them, actually. That movie is part> > > of my home collection.> > >> > > Ken.> > >> > > On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:> > >> > > >> > > >> > > > Ken Beanlands wrote:> > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything> > > > > about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?> > > >> > > > for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tom selleck> > > > movie,> > > > I think it was called "high road to china"> > > > regards> > > > JoeC> > > > Zion, Illinois> > > >> > >> > > Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> > > Calgary, Alberta, Canada> > > Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> > > > >> > Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> Calgary, Alberta, Canada> Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> ________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 11:42 am

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
The replica I've seen, I looked at at Oshkosh this year was from FisherFlying Products .They have the R-80 Tiger Moth. If I was going to build a biplane that wouldprobably be the one.It's a replica of the DeHaviland DH82A Tiger Moth at 80% scale. They alsohave quick build kits??? What's that???I thought that was when your wood didn't have bark on it....Greg Yotz-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 11:56 am

Original Posted By: Greg Yotz
You mean we are suppose to take the Bark off before glueing?I wonder if I should do my solid Spar over now.GordonRW-1 UL Piet----- Original Message -----________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 12:05 pm

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 12:27 pm

Original Posted By:> Ken Beanlands
I was looking at the R-80, but.... I'd prefer something closer to the"real thing". I know this next statment will get me in trouble on the Pietlist, but I really like the idea of the steel tube fuse of the original. Iknow all the pros and cons of both construction techniques, but for me thesteel tube is prefered.KenOn Wed, 15 Sep 1999, Greg Yotz wrote:> The replica I've seen, I looked at at Oshkosh this year was from Fisher> Flying Products .> They have the R-80 Tiger Moth. If I was going to build a biplane that would> probably be the one.> It's a replica of the DeHaviland DH82A Tiger Moth at 80% scale. They also> have quick build kits??? What's that???> I thought that was when your wood didn't have bark on it....> > Greg Yotz> > > > -----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 4:08 pm

Original Posted By:> Ken Beanlands
A Stampe is a biplane made mostly in Belgium from the late 30's to the mid40's. Uses a Gypsy engine and looks a little like a Moth but a little smallerand much more maneuverable. If you want to watch one, go to Old Rhinebeck anyweekend from May to October and watch the show. Gene DeMarco flies his blue andwhite one all the time there.robert hensarling wrote:> -----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 5:31 pm

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane (with a steel tube fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If you need more details I can supply them.Rob PassleyNX338RP Hatz (in work)NX899R Pietenpol (in work)________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 5:45 pm

Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
I've also been following the Hatz pages quite closely. It's certainly anice machine. However, the useful load is not as good with the Hatz andeventually, I'd like to have something to put on floats. The Tiger Mothmakes a beutiful floatplane with about 650 lbs of useful load left over,even on floats. My idea would be to put the greenhouse on it similar tothe Canadian trainer version.Maybe it's a pipe dream, but I have been able to shake down a couple ofleads. One of the Flying Farmers here in Alberta has one and may havedrawings.KenOn Wed, 15 Sep 1999 RPas909040(at)aol.com wrote:> If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane (with a steel tube> fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If you need more > details I can supply them.> > Rob Passley> NX338RP Hatz (in work)> NX899R Pietenpol (in work)> Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)Calgary, Alberta, CanadaChristavia MK 1 C-GREN________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 6:24 pm

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
Lot of people on the Ragwing list looking to build one that Roger is aboutready to release the plans for. I think it is maybe 80% scale.Are you talking about getting plans for the full size TM?Gordon----- Original Message -----________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 6:31 pm

Original Posted By: Craig Lawler
The plans for the upper cabane spar fittings as "U" channel made of 3/4X .90 strap, with 2 tab's welded below for the top of the cabane strut.Several people are telling that is wrong. Need to be 2 "U" channelswelded together at crotch, one facing up the other down. What have youother builders done? Leon S.________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 7:18 pm

Original Posted By: Greg Yotz
Greg,My first project was a Fisher Flying Product.....great company. Quality andsupportwalt-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 7:25 pm

Original Posted By: Leon Stefan
tabs, with the fwd ones having a fwd extension for the down angle tubes tothe engine mountswalt-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 8:04 pm

Original Posted By: John Woolsey
One thing to ask folks about is the Tiger Moth rigging book. They wrotean illustrated book that tells how to take Moth parts out of the box andput it together. I got to watch some friends put one together. Thereare a million complicated metal fittings and getting the wings riggedright is really something.This book has been reprinted, so once you get into the midst of a nestof Tiger Moth enthusasts you will be able to find one.On the subject of Tiger Moths, if you want one, why not buy one. Thereare a lot of them around. I've seen four different ones advertised inthe last year. Also, you can get projects. People ground loop orcapsize them regularly,as they can be a bear in a crosswind on pavement.________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 8:19 pm

Original Posted By:> Ken Beanlands
robert hensarling wrote:> -----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 8:55 pm

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
Ken, you may want to contact the Empire Training museum in Brandon,Manitoba. I believe tyhat they have (had) one, and also had the plans.----- Original Message -----________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Wed Sep 15, 1999 9:15 pm

Original Posted By: fishin
-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 12:47 am

Original Posted By: del magsam
For moth plans,I'd write or e-mail the smithsonian in wash DC., or the imperial war museum in england.>From a corner of my mind, I seem to remember several ww1 biplanes made a few miles from here, in Athol idaho, and the fellow got his plans from smithsonian historical files.I just happen to have a 3 view newport 28 drawing on 1 sheet w/cover off, and all bulkheads +wings and ribs in scale. I almost think that I could build a full scale airplane from just that sheet.>From: Ken Beanlands >Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion >To: Pietenpol Discussion >Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:45:03 -0600 (MDT)>>I've also been following the Hatz pages quite closely. It's certainly a>nice machine. However, the useful load is not as good with the Hatz and>eventually, I'd like to have something to put on floats. The Tiger Moth>makes a beutiful floatplane with about 650 lbs of useful load left over,>even on floats. My idea would be to put the greenhouse on it similar to>the Canadian trainer version.>>Maybe it's a pipe dream, but I have been able to shake down a couple of>leads. One of the Flying Farmers here in Alberta has one and may have>drawings.>>Ken>>On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 RPas909040(at)aol.com wrote:>> > If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane (with a steel >tube> > fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If you need >more> > details I can supply them.> >> > Rob Passley> > NX338RP Hatz (in work)> > NX899R Pietenpol (in work)> >>>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>Calgary, Alberta, Canada>Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 12:56 am

Original Posted By: Ian Holland
Umm...... That's the Commonwealth Air Training Plan Museum in BrandonManitoba, Ian, and yes we Do Have an 82a. It is maintained as a flightworthy aircraft and will be flying at our Open House and VolenteerAppreciation Day this weekend. (weather permitting). We hope to also fly theCornell and the Mk11 Harvard as well. I know it is a good days drive fromThunder Bay, but you are welcome, as is Wayne Sippola of Wpg. and any otherPiet or aviation nut with in range. :-)John Mc-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 6:23 am

Original Posted By: John R Bayer
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: center section cabane strut brackets:>While looking at the center cabane fittings, look at the strut attachfittings on the spars. I would strongly suggest that you redesign>them so they are aligned with the strut rather than intersecting at anaccute angle with the strut. The fittings as drawn introduce a>bending moment on the spar rather than distributing the load evenly.>>Greg Cardinal wrote:>>> I made the fittings using two u-shaped brackets. Mostly because I don'ttrust my welding enough to depend on them to hold up the plane.>> Do the math on these fittings and you will see just how overbuilt aPietenpol is. Incredible!>>>> Greg Cardinal>>>> >>> Leon Stefan 09/15 5:31 PM >>>>> The plans for the upper cabane spar fittings as "U" channel made of 3/4>> X .90 strap, with 2 tab's welded below for the top of the cabane strut.>> Several people are telling that is wrong. Need to be 2 "U" channels>> welded together at crotch, one facing up the other down. What have you>> other builders done? Leon S.>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 9:23 am

Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
The Smithsonian always has an add running in Wooden Boat for informationfrom their Marine Water Craft plans from the National WaterCraftCollection.Send a 10.00 check for a 250 page catalog. That must be a bunchof boat plans. So I suppoose they have something for aircraft. I think Iwill look on the net for something.try http://smithsonian-institution.comProbably .org or .govGordon> For moth plans,I'd write or e-mail the smithsonian in wash DC., or the> imperial war museum in england.>> From a corner of my mind, I seem to remember several ww1 biplanes made afew> miles from here, in Athol idaho, and the fellow got his plans from> smithsonian historical files.>> I just happen to have a 3 view newport 28 drawing on 1 sheet w/cover off,> and all bulkheads +wings and ribs in scale. I almost think that I could> build a full scale airplane from just that sheet.>>> >From: Ken Beanlands > >Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion > >To: Pietenpol Discussion > >Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth> >Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:45:03 -0600 (MDT)> >> >I've also been following the Hatz pages quite closely. It's certainly a> >nice machine. However, the useful load is not as good with the Hatz and> >eventually, I'd like to have something to put on floats. The Tiger Moth> >makes a beutiful floatplane with about 650 lbs of useful load left over,> >even on floats. My idea would be to put the greenhouse on it similar to> >the Canadian trainer version.> >> >Maybe it's a pipe dream, but I have been able to shake down a couple of> >leads. One of the Flying Farmers here in Alberta has one and may have> >drawings.> >> >Ken> >> >On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 RPas909040(at)aol.com wrote:> >> > > If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane (with asteel> >tube> > > fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If you need> >more> > > details I can supply them.> > >> > > Rob Passley> > > NX338RP Hatz (in work)> > > NX899R Pietenpol (in work)> > >> >> >Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> >Calgary, Alberta, Canada> >Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> >> >> >>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 10:01 am

Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
Smithsonion Home Page Ishttp://www.si.edu/newstart.htmHave not found plans yet but Im in the area.Gordon----- Original Message -----________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 2:05 pm

Original Posted By: walter evans
All their aircraft drawings come with the stipulation that you will neverbuild a man-carrying aircraft!John BayerThe First Across Organization"http://firstacross.hypermart.net/nc4home.htm" writes:>The Smithsonian always has an add running in Wooden Boat for >information>from their Marine Water Craft plans from the National WaterCraft>Collection.Send a 10.00 check for a 250 page catalog. That must be a >bunch>of boat plans. So I suppoose they have something for aircraft. I >think I>will look on the net for something.>>try http://smithsonian-institution.com>>Probably .org or .gov>>Gordon>>>> For moth plans,I'd write or e-mail the smithsonian in wash DC., or >the>> imperial war museum in england.>>>> From a corner of my mind, I seem to remember several ww1 biplanes >made a>few>> miles from here, in Athol idaho, and the fellow got his plans from>> smithsonian historical files.>>>> I just happen to have a 3 view newport 28 drawing on 1 sheet w/cover >off,>> and all bulkheads +wings and ribs in scale. I almost think that I >could>> build a full scale airplane from just that sheet.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From: Ken Beanlands >> >Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion >> >To: Pietenpol Discussion >> >Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>> >Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:45:03 -0600 (MDT)>> >>> >I've also been following the Hatz pages quite closely. It's >certainly a>> >nice machine. However, the useful load is not as good with the Hatz >and>> >eventually, I'd like to have something to put on floats. The Tiger >Moth>> >makes a beutiful floatplane with about 650 lbs of useful load left >over,>> >even on floats. My idea would be to put the greenhouse on it >similar to>> >the Canadian trainer version.>> >>> >Maybe it's a pipe dream, but I have been able to shake down a >couple of>> >leads. One of the Flying Farmers here in Alberta has one and may >have>> >drawings.>> >>> >Ken>> >>> >On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 RPas909040(at)aol.com wrote:>> >>> > > If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane (with >a>steel>> >tube>> > > fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If you >need>> >more>> > > details I can supply them.>> > >>> > > Rob Passley>> > > NX338RP Hatz (in work)>> > > NX899R Pietenpol (in work)>> > >>> >>> >Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>> >Calgary, Alberta, Canada>> >Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>> >>> >>> >>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 2:07 pm

Original Posted By: David B. Schober
If you are building the long fuselage, there is an improved print that hasthe new wing spar fittings to allign with the spars, right on that print.walt-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 3:01 pm

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
The Smithsonian does have a large collection of Aircraft plans housed atthe Paul E. Garber (SPELLING?) facelity in Silver Spring MD.Gordon Brimhall wrote:> > The Smithsonian always has an add running in Wooden Boat for information> from their Marine Water Craft plans from the National WaterCraft> Collection.Send a 10.00 check for a 250 page catalog. That must be a bunch> of boat plans. So I suppoose they have something for aircraft. I think I> will look on the net for something.> > try http://smithsonian-institution.com> > Probably .org or .gov> > Gordon> > > For moth plans,I'd write or e-mail the smithsonian in wash DC., or the> > imperial war museum in england.> >> > From a corner of my mind, I seem to remember several ww1 biplanes made a> few> > miles from here, in Athol idaho, and the fellow got his plans from> > smithsonian historical files.> >> > I just happen to have a 3 view newport 28 drawing on 1 sheet w/cover off,> > and all bulkheads +wings and ribs in scale. I almost think that I could> > build a full scale airplane from just that sheet.> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >From: Ken Beanlands > > >Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion > > >To: Pietenpol Discussion > > >Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth> > >Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:45:03 -0600 (MDT)> > >> > >I've also been following the Hatz pages quite closely. It's certainly a> > >nice machine. However, the useful load is not as good with the Hatz and> > >eventually, I'd like to have something to put on floats. The Tiger Moth> > >makes a beutiful floatplane with about 650 lbs of useful load left over,> > >even on floats. My idea would be to put the greenhouse on it similar to> > >the Canadian trainer version.> > >> > >Maybe it's a pipe dream, but I have been able to shake down a couple of> > >leads. One of the Flying Farmers here in Alberta has one and may have> > >drawings.> > >> > >Ken> > >> > >On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 RPas909040(at)aol.com wrote:> > >> > > > If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane (with a> steel> > >tube> > > > fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If you need> > >more> > > > details I can supply them.> > > >> > > > Rob Passley> > > > NX338RP Hatz (in work)> > > > NX899R Pietenpol (in work)> > > >> > >> > >Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> > >Calgary, Alberta, Canada> > >Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> > >> > >> > >> >> >________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 3:10 pm

Original Posted By: John R Bayer
Well most other plans have some disclaimer too. How many have you seensaying they are for educational learning only.?They are just covering their Butt.Gordon----- Original Message -----________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 3:11 pm

Original Posted By: John R Bayer
So where do we send to for information as you must know?Gordon----- Original Message ----- ________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 3:30 pm

Original Posted By: Jason Good
Contact the Smithsonian National Air & Space Museum Archives via:"http://www.nasm.edu/nasm/ARCH/"John BayerThe First Across Organization"http://firstacross.hypermart.net/nc4home.htm" writes:>So where do we send to for information as you must know?>>Gordon>>----- Original Message ----- >From: John R Bayer >To: Pietenpol Discussion >Sent: Thursday, September 16, 1999 12:05 PM>Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>>>> All their aircraft drawings come with the stipulation that you will >never>> build a man-carrying aircraft!>> >> John Bayer>> The First Across Organization>> "http://firstacross.hypermart.net/nc4home.htm">> >> >> writes:>> >The Smithsonian always has an add running in Wooden Boat for >> >information>> >from their Marine Water Craft plans from the National WaterCraft>> >Collection.Send a 10.00 check for a 250 page catalog. That must be >a >> >bunch>> >of boat plans. So I suppoose they have something for aircraft. I >> >think I>> >will look on the net for something.>> >>> >try http://smithsonian-institution.com>> >>> >Probably .org or .gov>> >>> >Gordon>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> For moth plans,I'd write or e-mail the smithsonian in wash DC., >or >> >the>> >> imperial war museum in england.>> >>>> >> From a corner of my mind, I seem to remember several ww1 biplanes >>> >made a>> >few>> >> miles from here, in Athol idaho, and the fellow got his plans >from>> >> smithsonian historical files.>> >>>> >> I just happen to have a 3 view newport 28 drawing on 1 sheet >w/cover >> >off,>> >> and all bulkheads +wings and ribs in scale. I almost think that I >>> >could>> >> build a full scale airplane from just that sheet.>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >From: Ken Beanlands >> >> >Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion >> >> >To: Pietenpol Discussion >> >> >Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>> >> >Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:45:03 -0600 (MDT)>> >> >>> >> >I've also been following the Hatz pages quite closely. It's >> >certainly a>> >> >nice machine. However, the useful load is not as good with the >Hatz >> >and>> >> >eventually, I'd like to have something to put on floats. The >Tiger >> >Moth>> >> >makes a beutiful floatplane with about 650 lbs of useful load >left >> >over,>> >> >even on floats. My idea would be to put the greenhouse on it >> >similar to>> >> >the Canadian trainer version.>> >> >>> >> >Maybe it's a pipe dream, but I have been able to shake down a >> >couple of>> >> >leads. One of the Flying Farmers here in Alberta has one and may >>> >have>> >> >drawings.>> >> >>> >> >Ken>> >> >>> >> >On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 RPas909040(at)aol.com wrote:>> >> >>> >> > > If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane >(with >> >a>> >steel>> >> >tube>> >> > > fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If >you >> >need>> >> >more>> >> > > details I can supply them.>> >> > >>> >> > > Rob Passley>> >> > > NX338RP Hatz (in work)>> >> > > NX899R Pietenpol (in work)>> >> > >>> >> >>> >> >Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>> >> >Calgary, Alberta, Canada>> >> >Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>>> >>>> >>> >________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Thu Sep 16, 1999 9:02 pm

Original Posted By: John R Bayer
Thanks for the info, I spent some time their, I don't see any easy way toget a list of aircraft plans and technical data. BUt that is sure a bigplace with millions of documents.Gordon----- Original Message -----________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:28 pm

Original Posted By: User554784(at)aol.com
> Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>>> >OK, I didn't say it was PERFECT

. Besides, if you were to build a> >homebuilt version, you could fix a lot of that

.> >> >On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything> >about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth? More specifically, does anyone know where> >to get plans for such a plane? I know, they are a production plane, but> >with many of them being restored in museums, someone must have access to> >the blueprints or structural drawings. This is my all time favorite plane> >and I would love to build a 100 % replica of teh bird. Construction onthe> >versions I've seen doesn't appear difficult and looks like it couldeasily> >be reprodiced by someone with some engineering and homebuilding> >experience, ie. ME.> >> >I could see using one of the new Walter Lom 4 cylinder, inverted, inline> >engines for power. They would fit nicely under that cowl. Basicstructural> >plans would be a good start. Wing rib layouts and spar details would be> >useful as well. Control and fitting diagrams would be good, but not a> >necessity. After all, most of the controls run outside the plane

.> >Given an empty weight of around 1100 lbs, there is not a lot more to a> >Tiger Moth than there is in a Citabria/Super Cub.> >> >Any ideas would be appreciated.> >> >Ken> >> >> Surley I jest about these points, heck anything that flies> >> interests me...just some more than others.> >> Common down Ken, we'll go fly the Cub around for a while !!> >>> >> >> >Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> >Calgary, Alberta, Canada> >Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> >> >> >> >> >>>________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:28 pm

Original Posted By: Earl Myers
> Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth> > > >OK, I didn't say it was PERFECT

. Besides, if you were to build a> >homebuilt version, you could fix a lot of that

.> >> >On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know anything> >about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth? More specifically, does anyone know where> >to get plans for such a plane? I know, they are a production plane, but> >with many of them being restored in museums, someone must have access to> >the blueprints or structural drawings. This is my all time favorite plane> >and I would love to build a 100 % replica of teh bird. Construction on the> >versions I've seen doesn't appear difficult and looks like it could easily> >be reprodiced by someone with some engineering and homebuilding> >experience, ie. ME.> >> >I could see using one of the new Walter Lom 4 cylinder, inverted, inline> >engines for power. They would fit nicely under that cowl. Basic structural> >plans would be a good start. Wing rib layouts and spar details would be> >useful as well. Control and fitting diagrams would be good, but not a> >necessity. After all, most of the controls run outside the plane

.> >Given an empty weight of around 1100 lbs, there is not a lot more to a> >Tiger Moth than there is in a Citabria/Super Cub.> >> >Any ideas would be appreciated.> >> >Ken> >> >> Surley I jest about these points, heck anything that flies> >> interests me...just some more than others.> >> Common down Ken, we'll go fly the Cub around for a while !!> >>> >> >> >Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> >Calgary, Alberta, Canada> >Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> >> >> >> >> >> Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)Calgary, Alberta, CanadaChristavia MK 1 C-GREN________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:28 pm

Original Posted By: steve(at)byu.edu
> Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>> I also love that movie (and Bess Armstrong) because of the planes, vintage> cloths, etc. I have to ask though, exactly what is a stamp? Company that> made it? Years made? Country made, etc. Since this isn't Pietenpol> related, direct email is fine.>> >The last 5 minutes of the movie, during the credits, is nothing but the> >Stampe flying a graceful aerobatic routine. Wonderful movie.> >> >Ken> >> >On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:> >> >> oh well,,,they were just as purty and the flying scenes made you wish it> was> >> you in the cockpit> >> JoeC> >>> >> Ken Beanlands wrote:> >>> >> > Close, but that was a Stampe. Three of them, actually. That movie is> part> >> > of my home collection.> >> >> >> > Ken.> >> >> >> > On Tue, 14 Sep 1999, fishin wrote:> >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > > Ken Beanlands wrote:> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > > On a completely different subject, does anyone out there know> anything> >> > > > about the old DH-82 Tiger Moth?> >> > >> >> > > for some great flying scenes of the tiger moth, check out the tom> selleck> >> > > movie,> >> > > I think it was called "high road to china"> >> > > regards> >> > > JoeC> >> > > Zion, Illinois> >> > >> >> >> >> > Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> >> > Calgary, Alberta, Canada> >> > Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> >> > > >>> >> >Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> >Calgary, Alberta, Canada> >Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> >> >> >> >--________________________________________________________________________________

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:28 pm

Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca>
> Subject: Re: Piet/Cub and DH-82 Tiger Moth>> I also love that movie (and Bess Armstrong) because of the planes, vintage> cloths, etc. I have to ask though, exactly what is a stamp? Company that> made it? Years made? Country made, etc.Stampe J series, Belgium, 1918/1933 100hp hall-scott engineStampe SV4 1933, 130hp deHavilland Gipsy Major enginemilitary trainersSV4B France 140hp Renault engineJoeCrobert hensarling wrote:-----Original Message-----

matronics · Post by **matronics** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:28 pm

Original Posted By: Michael King
> > >> > >I've also been following the Hatz pages quite closely. It's certainly a> > >nice machine. However, the useful load is not as good with the Hatz and> > >eventually, I'd like to have something to put on floats. The Tiger Moth> > >makes a beutiful floatplane with about 650 lbs of useful load leftover,> > >even on floats. My idea would be to put the greenhouse on it similar to> > >the Canadian trainer version.> > >> > >Maybe it's a pipe dream, but I have been able to shake down a couple of> > >leads. One of the Flying Farmers here in Alberta has one and may have> > >drawings.> > >> > >Ken> > >> > >On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 RPas909040(at)aol.com wrote:> > >> > > > If you're looking for a wonderful, sweet-handling biplane (with a> steel> > >tube> > > > fuselage even) try the Hatz Biplane, you won't be sorry. If you need> > >more> > > > details I can supply them.> > > >> > > > Rob Passley> > > > NX338RP Hatz (in work)> > > > NX899R Pietenpol (in work)> > > >> > >> > >Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)> > >Calgary, Alberta, Canada> > >Christavia MK 1 C-GREN> > >> > >> > >> >> >>>________________________________________________________________________________