Original Posted By: Steve Eldredge
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet>>All,> If Steve's 100% fir Piet weighs 630lbs. Take away 200lbs for engine, 30>lbs for covering, instruments, hardware, etc. should leave you with a wood>airframe at about 400lbs. Assuming that fir is 25% heavier than spruce>(Wood Book), a comparable airframe in spruce would weigh in at about300lbs.>I'm becoming suspicious about the 25% heavier figure!>Comments, anyone?>>Joe>>________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
All, If Steve's 100% fir Piet weighs 630lbs. Take away 200lbs for engine, 30 lbs for covering, instruments, hardware, etc. should leave you with a wood airframe at about 400lbs. Assuming that fir is 25% heavier than spruce (Wood Book), a comparable airframe in spruce would weigh in at about 300lbs.I'm becoming suspicious about the 25% heavier figure!Comments, anyone?Joe________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 08:11:14 -0700 (MST)
All, If Steve's 100% fir Piet weighs 630lbs. Take away 200lbs for engine, 30 lbs for covering, instruments, hardware, etc. should leave you with a wood airframe at about 400lbs. Assuming that fir is 25% heavier than spruce (Wood Book), a comparable airframe in spruce would weigh in at about 300lbs.I'm becoming suspicious about the 25% heavier figure!Comments, anyone?Joe________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 08:11:14 -0700 (MST)
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: Joe Krzes
You haven't taken all the hardware out like wheels, seats, etc.Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)-----Original Message-----
You haven't taken all the hardware out like wheels, seats, etc.Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)-----Original Message-----
RE: Pietenpol-List: Experimenter...Was Wing rib.
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Thanks for the kudo's it is kind of neat to see the article. I hadn't beena subscriber, but now I am. I should have said something about usingspruce, and now that you mention it I am surprised that I didn't! Duh....Judging from the other articles I would agree that it is a great deal andwould suggest others subscribe. The editor Mary Jones is great to work withand is excited about affordable flying machines.Just my $.02Steve E.-----Original Message-----
Thanks for the kudo's it is kind of neat to see the article. I hadn't beena subscriber, but now I am. I should have said something about usingspruce, and now that you mention it I am surprised that I didn't! Duh....Judging from the other articles I would agree that it is a great deal andwould suggest others subscribe. The editor Mary Jones is great to work withand is excited about affordable flying machines.Just my $.02Steve E.-----Original Message-----
RE: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
I doubt just the wood in the plane weighs 400lbs. My guess is that it ismore like 225lbs. I didn't weigh it, but It just isn't that heavy. I couldmove the wing panels by myself until they were covered and they became tohard to handle, and the fuse is only about 70lbs naked. What adds up is theengine and mount, control system, LANDING GEAR, Struts and braces andfittings, instruments, cowling, fuel tank and plumbage, covering, paint,wood varnish, hardware, etc...So 15% (if it is that much) of 225 is 30lbs or so. My guess is that thedifference is less than that, since we are still talking plywood, glue, andfasteners (nails ~1.5lbs). I plan on building all my future planes with DFunless I'm given a load of spruce.Probably more than you wanted to know.Steve E.Provo, UT-----Original Message-----
I doubt just the wood in the plane weighs 400lbs. My guess is that it ismore like 225lbs. I didn't weigh it, but It just isn't that heavy. I couldmove the wing panels by myself until they were covered and they became tohard to handle, and the fuse is only about 70lbs naked. What adds up is theengine and mount, control system, LANDING GEAR, Struts and braces andfittings, instruments, cowling, fuel tank and plumbage, covering, paint,wood varnish, hardware, etc...So 15% (if it is that much) of 225 is 30lbs or so. My guess is that thedifference is less than that, since we are still talking plywood, glue, andfasteners (nails ~1.5lbs). I plan on building all my future planes with DFunless I'm given a load of spruce.Probably more than you wanted to know.Steve E.Provo, UT-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: Rodger & Betty
RE: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: "Mike Lund"
That's EXACTLY what I wanted to know.Thanks,Joe>From: Steve Eldredge >>I doubt just the wood in the plane weighs 400lbs. My guess is that it is>more like 225lbs. I didn't weigh it, but It just isn't that heavy. I >could>move the wing panels by myself until they were covered and they became to>hard to handle, and the fuse is only about 70lbs naked. What adds up is >the>engine and mount, control system, LANDING GEAR, Struts and braces and>fittings, instruments, cowling, fuel tank and plumbage, covering, paint,>wood varnish, hardware, etc...>>So 15% (if it is that much) of 225 is 30lbs or so. My guess is that the>difference is less than that, since we are still talking plywood, glue, and>fasteners (nails ~1.5lbs). I plan on building all my future planes with DF>unless I'm given a load of spruce.>>Probably more than you wanted to know.>>Steve E.>Provo, UT>________________________________________________________________________________
That's EXACTLY what I wanted to know.Thanks,Joe>From: Steve Eldredge >>I doubt just the wood in the plane weighs 400lbs. My guess is that it is>more like 225lbs. I didn't weigh it, but It just isn't that heavy. I >could>move the wing panels by myself until they were covered and they became to>hard to handle, and the fuse is only about 70lbs naked. What adds up is >the>engine and mount, control system, LANDING GEAR, Struts and braces and>fittings, instruments, cowling, fuel tank and plumbage, covering, paint,>wood varnish, hardware, etc...>>So 15% (if it is that much) of 225 is 30lbs or so. My guess is that the>difference is less than that, since we are still talking plywood, glue, and>fasteners (nails ~1.5lbs). I plan on building all my future planes with DF>unless I'm given a load of spruce.>>Probably more than you wanted to know.>>Steve E.>Provo, UT>________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: "Gary Meadows"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir PietA couple of questions about the dimensions for the tail feathers: Is the trailing edge of the vertical stabilizer rounded like the leading edge or is it squared like the main beam? Looks like the trailing edge of the horizontal stab is considered "main beam" and is squared. How about the tips of the horizontal stab and elevators - are they shaped like the leading or trailing edges? Thanks, Tom Travis________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir PietA couple of questions about the dimensions for the tail feathers: Is the trailing edge of the vertical stabilizer rounded like the leading edge or is it squared like the main beam? Looks like the trailing edge of the horizontal stab is considered "main beam" and is squared. How about the tips of the horizontal stab and elevators - are they shaped like the leading or trailing edges? Thanks, Tom Travis________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: "Greg Cardinal"
Tom, Funny you should ask! I've been building on these recently and Here is how I interpret it: Vertical Stab and Horizontal stab - all hinged surfaces square. Inside elevator - square. Vstab and hstab leading edge - round Top of vstab, top and bottom rudder, outside of hstab, elevator all round. Rudder and Elevator Trailing edge - Best you can do streamline.This isn't exactly how I built mine, but it's how I think you're supposed to do it. Now, that said, you can build them just about any old way you want to! I'm square and tapering on the top and bottom of the rudder and top of the vstab. Hope this helps some! Biggest thing, just settle on something and do it - that makes it Yours!Gary________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 14:41:11 -0600
Tom, Funny you should ask! I've been building on these recently and Here is how I interpret it: Vertical Stab and Horizontal stab - all hinged surfaces square. Inside elevator - square. Vstab and hstab leading edge - round Top of vstab, top and bottom rudder, outside of hstab, elevator all round. Rudder and Elevator Trailing edge - Best you can do streamline.This isn't exactly how I built mine, but it's how I think you're supposed to do it. Now, that said, you can build them just about any old way you want to! I'm square and tapering on the top and bottom of the rudder and top of the vstab. Hope this helps some! Biggest thing, just settle on something and do it - that makes it Yours!Gary________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 14:41:11 -0600
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: "Michael Brusilow"
Tom, I agree that the plans aren't real clear here and I've seen different Piets built differently. I decided to use leading edge all the way around except for trailing edge and the main beam (of course). I haven't started gluing yet, but I did rough cut all of the wood and bundled it so I now have a tail kit ready to go. I still think this will work very well. The only change I might consider is making the inboard edges of the elevators out of main beam also. I also ordered all my leading edge material pre-shaped "T-stringer" from Wicks. If you want to see my wood order and how I cut it, go to this link:http://www.hal-pc.org/~hjkr/building_log.htmJoeIs the>trailing edge of the vertical stabilizer rounded like the leading edge or >is>it squared like the main beam? Looks like the trailing edge of the>horizontal stab is considered "main beam" and is squared.>>How about the tips of the horizontal stab and elevators - are they shaped>like the leading or trailing edges?________________________________________________________________________________
Tom, I agree that the plans aren't real clear here and I've seen different Piets built differently. I decided to use leading edge all the way around except for trailing edge and the main beam (of course). I haven't started gluing yet, but I did rough cut all of the wood and bundled it so I now have a tail kit ready to go. I still think this will work very well. The only change I might consider is making the inboard edges of the elevators out of main beam also. I also ordered all my leading edge material pre-shaped "T-stringer" from Wicks. If you want to see my wood order and how I cut it, go to this link:http://www.hal-pc.org/~hjkr/building_log.htmJoeIs the>trailing edge of the vertical stabilizer rounded like the leading edge or >is>it squared like the main beam? Looks like the trailing edge of the>horizontal stab is considered "main beam" and is squared.>>How about the tips of the horizontal stab and elevators - are they shaped>like the leading or trailing edges?________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: VAHOWDY(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir PietThanks a lot for posting that log file. It is really helpful. Ihope that you continue to document with this detail and share with thelist.Mike BellColumbia, SC________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir PietThanks a lot for posting that log file. It is really helpful. Ihope that you continue to document with this detail and share with thelist.Mike BellColumbia, SC________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir Piet
Original Posted By: nle97(at)juno.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir PietTom, The leading of the tail control surfaces and trailing edges of thestabilizers, the parts that face each other and are hinged, are the same. They are tee shaped and are not rounded. The leading edge of thestabilizers are rounded off and the trailing edges of the controlsurfaces are shaped like a rounded arrow head. Orin Hoopman's plans showthe cross sectional shape of these members. Just make the edges andtrailing edges streamlined when assembled and you will be alright.John LangstonPipe Creek, TXnle97(at)juno.com________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fir PietTom, The leading of the tail control surfaces and trailing edges of thestabilizers, the parts that face each other and are hinged, are the same. They are tee shaped and are not rounded. The leading edge of thestabilizers are rounded off and the trailing edges of the controlsurfaces are shaped like a rounded arrow head. Orin Hoopman's plans showthe cross sectional shape of these members. Just make the edges andtrailing edges streamlined when assembled and you will be alright.John LangstonPipe Creek, TXnle97(at)juno.com________________________________________________________________________________