Original Posted By: clif
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model AAre there very many builders using the Model A?I am planing on using an A engine myself.Can someone give me some insight on known pro's & con's.DanArdmore, OK________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 23:55:52 -0800
Pietenpol-List: Model A
RE: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Dan I have not finished my Model B engine for my Piet. but I am a Model AAtruck and Model A car fan as well as a Piet builder. The A engine is 200cu.in. displacement and depending on how well you do your research andbuilding it is capable of producing a good 50 to 75 hp. One of the neatthings about it as opposed to modern engine conversions (I'm not knockingyou corvair guys) is that it produces its power at the right rpm for adirect drive prop. Check around for engines with your local Model A Ford Club. They will mostlikely be excited about your engine idea and know where to get parts. Theengine suffers from small ports and being a flat head, better breathing isthe single biggest power improvement you can make to an A. The B engine isthe same displacement and appearance but has a stouter crank. This allowsfor drilling the crank for pressure oiling of the rods. Rods, pistons valvesand bearings can all be updated to modern specs. Creative weight savingmethods, one of which is getting rid of the heavy splash oiling system panand using a Dan Price or Brumfield aluminum head you can actually get closeto air-cooled engine weight. But if not, the wing further forward on an APiet looks better to me. The engine is only as good as the sum of its partsso if you choose it, do it right! In Bernard Pietenpols day A and B engineswere fresh and plentiful. Not so now but we can upgrade them withtechnology.Best of LuckJohn-----Original Message-----
Dan I have not finished my Model B engine for my Piet. but I am a Model AAtruck and Model A car fan as well as a Piet builder. The A engine is 200cu.in. displacement and depending on how well you do your research andbuilding it is capable of producing a good 50 to 75 hp. One of the neatthings about it as opposed to modern engine conversions (I'm not knockingyou corvair guys) is that it produces its power at the right rpm for adirect drive prop. Check around for engines with your local Model A Ford Club. They will mostlikely be excited about your engine idea and know where to get parts. Theengine suffers from small ports and being a flat head, better breathing isthe single biggest power improvement you can make to an A. The B engine isthe same displacement and appearance but has a stouter crank. This allowsfor drilling the crank for pressure oiling of the rods. Rods, pistons valvesand bearings can all be updated to modern specs. Creative weight savingmethods, one of which is getting rid of the heavy splash oiling system panand using a Dan Price or Brumfield aluminum head you can actually get closeto air-cooled engine weight. But if not, the wing further forward on an APiet looks better to me. The engine is only as good as the sum of its partsso if you choose it, do it right! In Bernard Pietenpols day A and B engineswere fresh and plentiful. Not so now but we can upgrade them withtechnology.Best of LuckJohn-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "D. Engelkenjohn"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model AIn a message dated 4/25/03 9:42:20 AM Central Daylight Time, hpvs(at)southwind.net writes:>Mike,This is a generous offer, and I thank you for it. However, I am too close to hearing the ol' Continental A65 come to life. I've been working on the cowling, and eyebrows today. As soon as I finish the prop, and exhaust, I'll be doing the first engine run on my new engine. Chuck Gantzer________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 06:13:49 -0500
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model AIn a message dated 4/25/03 9:42:20 AM Central Daylight Time, hpvs(at)southwind.net writes:>Mike,This is a generous offer, and I thank you for it. However, I am too close to hearing the ol' Continental A65 come to life. I've been working on the cowling, and eyebrows today. As soon as I finish the prop, and exhaust, I'll be doing the first engine run on my new engine. Chuck Gantzer________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 06:13:49 -0500
Re: Pietenpol-List: wing back how far, Carl ?
Original Posted By: "Michael D Cuy"
Mike,,,, I set the wing back 3 1/2 inches and the motor mount is out 2inches. The mains are split V piet style.Looks like Bob Seibert is sitting on the edge with me getting close togettin some air under the wing.With a lot of the guys reporting great progress, we could have a heck of ashowing at Brodhead in 2004.On a sad note,,, The guy that's been flying Bill Poiry's piet, came in alittle too slow on a NW Ohio windy day.Wind gust got him and he dropped her pretty hard. No serious human injuriesbut the piet got bent quite a bit.Remember boys,,, give that gas a crack more when the ole winds start toblow. Bill says he will have it backtogether hopefully by fall.Carl----- Original Message -----
Mike,,,, I set the wing back 3 1/2 inches and the motor mount is out 2inches. The mains are split V piet style.Looks like Bob Seibert is sitting on the edge with me getting close togettin some air under the wing.With a lot of the guys reporting great progress, we could have a heck of ashowing at Brodhead in 2004.On a sad note,,, The guy that's been flying Bill Poiry's piet, came in alittle too slow on a NW Ohio windy day.Wind gust got him and he dropped her pretty hard. No serious human injuriesbut the piet got bent quite a bit.Remember boys,,, give that gas a crack more when the ole winds start toblow. Bill says he will have it backtogether hopefully by fall.Carl----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "Jack Textor"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model AJim, is this maintenance manual for the car or engine? What is the exact title and how much are you asking for it? Don Hicks________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model AJim, is this maintenance manual for the car or engine? What is the exact title and how much are you asking for it? Don Hicks________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "Rick Holland"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A Jim, Got your CD. Thanks so much. I am very much interested in the "A" you have. Give me a call if you get time or send me your # and I'll give you a ring.Ron412-894-8707________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2006 15:06:55 -0700
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A Jim, Got your CD. Thanks so much. I am very much interested in the "A" you have. Give me a call if you get time or send me your # and I'll give you a ring.Ron412-894-8707________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2006 15:06:55 -0700
Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing strut fitting question
Original Posted By: Rick Holland
RickYou could leave it like that and take a scrap piece of steel to fill the triangle ends. What I did though is kept working it in a vise while tapping on the rounded end with a hammer. It tightened up small enough to fill with welding rod Oxy/Acl.Dick N. ----- Original Message -----
RickYou could leave it like that and take a scrap piece of steel to fill the triangle ends. What I did though is kept working it in a vise while tapping on the rounded end with a hammer. It tightened up small enough to fill with welding rod Oxy/Acl.Dick N. ----- Original Message -----
RE: Pietenpol-List: Wing strut fitting question
Original Posted By: "Jack T. Textor"
Rick,The lift strut end fitting is one of the most difficult fittings to make on the entire airplane.Attached is a PDF of a drawing from the Boredom Fighter plans.Go to the bottom of the drawing; it shows how to make a tool for making this bend.The tubing will have a tendency to burn away when you attemp to weld it. To prevent this leave excess length on the tubing while welding. It may also help to insert a loose fitting bolt into the tubing to act as a heat sink.Greg CardinalP.S. I would also like to respectfully recommend that you polish the edges of your sheet stock prior to bending. It will prevent cracks later on. Guys Am attempting to make my top wing strut fittings (bending .090" strap around a piece of tubing), in advance of receiving my struts from Jack. Have the strap bent around the tube but I can't come up with a good way to finish bending the strap tight all the way around the tube (see picture). How did you guys do it? And how much of a gap can I have? Thanks -- Rick Holland________________________________________________________________________________Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wing strut fitting questionDate: Sat, 28 Oct 2006 07:26:54 -0500
Rick,The lift strut end fitting is one of the most difficult fittings to make on the entire airplane.Attached is a PDF of a drawing from the Boredom Fighter plans.Go to the bottom of the drawing; it shows how to make a tool for making this bend.The tubing will have a tendency to burn away when you attemp to weld it. To prevent this leave excess length on the tubing while welding. It may also help to insert a loose fitting bolt into the tubing to act as a heat sink.Greg CardinalP.S. I would also like to respectfully recommend that you polish the edges of your sheet stock prior to bending. It will prevent cracks later on. Guys Am attempting to make my top wing strut fittings (bending .090" strap around a piece of tubing), in advance of receiving my struts from Jack. Have the strap bent around the tube but I can't come up with a good way to finish bending the strap tight all the way around the tube (see picture). How did you guys do it? And how much of a gap can I have? Thanks -- Rick Holland________________________________________________________________________________Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wing strut fitting questionDate: Sat, 28 Oct 2006 07:26:54 -0500
Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing strut fitting question
Original Posted By: "Rick Holland"
Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing strut fitting question
Original Posted By: Matt Dralle
Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "GlennThomas(at)flyingwood.com"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model ADan: I bought an already converted A, but the builder didn't puthardened seats under the valves for no lead fuel, so I am going to gointo it and have that done. Also I want the insert bearings. Did youhave hardened seats installed? It's been a couple of years since Italked to Ken about counter balanced crank. At that time he said it wasnot needed for our low rpm range.. What caused him to change his mind?Did you get the weld on counter balances? Did the builder have a cowwhen you told him it was for an airplane, or did you keep that a secret?What was your total cost from the builder? You don't have to answer thatif you don't want to. Leon S. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model ADan: I bought an already converted A, but the builder didn't puthardened seats under the valves for no lead fuel, so I am going to gointo it and have that done. Also I want the insert bearings. Did youhave hardened seats installed? It's been a couple of years since Italked to Ken about counter balanced crank. At that time he said it wasnot needed for our low rpm range.. What caused him to change his mind?Did you get the weld on counter balances? Did the builder have a cowwhen you told him it was for an airplane, or did you keep that a secret?What was your total cost from the builder? You don't have to answer thatif you don't want to. Leon S. ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "Dick Navratil"
Question to the list, with the model A engine what water temp and oil temp are you seeing. The out side air is about 80 degree, and the water temp is up to 200 degrees in the climb and about 190 to 195 stright and level at 1600 RPMs.The oil after about 10 minutes will go up to a185 degrees, if I reduce power and start to land with in a couple of minutes the oil will drop back to 180 degrees.Any and all thoughts please.Chet Hartley / Don Hicks really nice flying machine________________________________________________________________________________
Question to the list, with the model A engine what water temp and oil temp are you seeing. The out side air is about 80 degree, and the water temp is up to 200 degrees in the climb and about 190 to 195 stright and level at 1600 RPMs.The oil after about 10 minutes will go up to a185 degrees, if I reduce power and start to land with in a couple of minutes the oil will drop back to 180 degrees.Any and all thoughts please.Chet Hartley / Don Hicks really nice flying machine________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: jorge lizarraga
Hello everyone,I was on vacation for a month or so and finally am caught up with the 600 or so posts on the Pietenpol list. It is truly amazing how active this group is. For flying low and slow we do seem to post like the fast and furious!Anyway, like every builder, I am contemplating engine choices for my yet to be started Pietenpol. I never thought I would consider the Ford Model A mainly because I am not that much of a purist. However, when opportunity knocks, who am I to ignore?I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield replaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that he is willing to part for free. Given my gross ignorance about all things engines (we all have to start somewhere), I have no recourse but to ask the good folks of this list-- Is this something I should acquire and decide later if I am going to use it or not? Is there a particular model year that is better suited for flight? The condition of the engine is unknown, but hey the price is just right!Your help is much appreciated!Ameet Savant- - - le, List Admin.=0A=0A=0A ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 21:59:12 -0700 (PDT)
Hello everyone,I was on vacation for a month or so and finally am caught up with the 600 or so posts on the Pietenpol list. It is truly amazing how active this group is. For flying low and slow we do seem to post like the fast and furious!Anyway, like every builder, I am contemplating engine choices for my yet to be started Pietenpol. I never thought I would consider the Ford Model A mainly because I am not that much of a purist. However, when opportunity knocks, who am I to ignore?I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield replaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that he is willing to part for free. Given my gross ignorance about all things engines (we all have to start somewhere), I have no recourse but to ask the good folks of this list-- Is this something I should acquire and decide later if I am going to use it or not? Is there a particular model year that is better suited for flight? The condition of the engine is unknown, but hey the price is just right!Your help is much appreciated!Ameet Savant- - - le, List Admin.=0A=0A=0A ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 21:59:12 -0700 (PDT)
Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "Ameet Savant"
Ameet,The Ford engine is a good engine for the piet, the only thing I would do different is to install a counter balanced crank shaft. You can buy one or have yours balanced.Chet Hartley 920Y----- Original Message -----
Ameet,The Ford engine is a good engine for the piet, the only thing I would do different is to install a counter balanced crank shaft. You can buy one or have yours balanced.Chet Hartley 920Y----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: Re: three tenths flight time
Original Posted By: "Pieti Lowell"
Doesn't sound like much=2C but it sure was a great flight. We had a heavy passing thunderstorm today so I was inside the hangar most of the afternoon but when it got done raining=2C there wasn't much wind and I knew I'd have to go fly. It is so nice to fly in an open cockpit in conditions like these: cool=2C clean air=2C everything fresh from a rain=2C and the airplane flies strong and smooth. The smells are richer and the colors of everything seem brighter and more true. So I didn't fly for long but I didn't have to- it was enough. My three landings were all nearly perfect=2C a little standing water splashing the tires=2C then we were home.This is what Mr. Pietenpol must have had in his mind when he first set out to design the Air Camper more than 80 years ago=2C and why he kept after it when the first few versions didn't quite match the picture he had in his mind. Minimal preflight=2C minimal fuss and planning=2C and you're out flying. No charts=2C no radios=2C no gadgets=2C nothing. I used my canvas flying helmet and goggles=2C didn't even bother with the other helmet with hearing protectors because when I use the plain canvas=2C I can hear the wind in the wires when I pull off the power for landing. This is Piet flying. Oscar ZunigaAir Camper NX41CCSan Antonio=2C TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: three tenths flight time
Doesn't sound like much=2C but it sure was a great flight. We had a heavy passing thunderstorm today so I was inside the hangar most of the afternoon but when it got done raining=2C there wasn't much wind and I knew I'd have to go fly. It is so nice to fly in an open cockpit in conditions like these: cool=2C clean air=2C everything fresh from a rain=2C and the airplane flies strong and smooth. The smells are richer and the colors of everything seem brighter and more true. So I didn't fly for long but I didn't have to- it was enough. My three landings were all nearly perfect=2C a little standing water splashing the tires=2C then we were home.This is what Mr. Pietenpol must have had in his mind when he first set out to design the Air Camper more than 80 years ago=2C and why he kept after it when the first few versions didn't quite match the picture he had in his mind. Minimal preflight=2C minimal fuss and planning=2C and you're out flying. No charts=2C no radios=2C no gadgets=2C nothing. I used my canvas flying helmet and goggles=2C didn't even bother with the other helmet with hearing protectors because when I use the plain canvas=2C I can hear the wind in the wires when I pull off the power for landing. This is Piet flying. Oscar ZunigaAir Camper NX41CCSan Antonio=2C TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: three tenths flight time
Original Posted By: "ALAN LYSCARS"
Aman-Oscar. I have been flying Pietenpols for well over 40 some odd years You havesaid it all. I have never ever missed flying a Piet to the annual Brodheadfly-in. This is also my 80Th also . I have known the greats, most have signedmy logs and you guys are carrying the torch, and with all the great commentsI read, keep It up, see you at Brodhead.Pieti LowellRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Aman-Oscar. I have been flying Pietenpols for well over 40 some odd years You havesaid it all. I have never ever missed flying a Piet to the annual Brodheadfly-in. This is also my 80Th also . I have known the greats, most have signedmy logs and you guys are carrying the torch, and with all the great commentsI read, keep It up, see you at Brodhead.Pieti LowellRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "Ameet Savant"
Ameet..Possession is always 100% of a resource's value. Take it and use it later, trade or sell it later, or scrap it later. Just plain Yankee attitude!Al in New Hampshire----- Original Message -----
Ameet..Possession is always 100% of a resource's value. Take it and use it later, trade or sell it later, or scrap it later. Just plain Yankee attitude!Al in New Hampshire----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: jorge lizarraga
Pietenpol-List: Re: california
Original Posted By: "Jerry Dotson"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model AIn one of the old Buckeye news letters, Frank Pvaglia suggestedlengthening the fus. 6 inches at the nose with the A. I lengthened mymotor mt. 4" and probably should have gone 2 more inches. Ken Perkinsextended his mt. 7" He was pretty heavy then, but has since lostweight. . Chuck Ganzer had to put 14lbs of lead on the front of hismodel A. BHP came from an era when a fat person was rare, and the term"couch potato" wasn't even invented yet.Brodhead is only 2 months away,go and attend Ken Perkins's modle A forum. Leon S. in Kansas.________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: california
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model AIn one of the old Buckeye news letters, Frank Pvaglia suggestedlengthening the fus. 6 inches at the nose with the A. I lengthened mymotor mt. 4" and probably should have gone 2 more inches. Ken Perkinsextended his mt. 7" He was pretty heavy then, but has since lostweight. . Chuck Ganzer had to put 14lbs of lead on the front of hismodel A. BHP came from an era when a fat person was rare, and the term"couch potato" wasn't even invented yet.Brodhead is only 2 months away,go and attend Ken Perkins's modle A forum. Leon S. in Kansas.________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: california
Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: "Will42"
OK as usual I'm sure this has been hashed over before.but I don't try to go intoarchives and hunt well.I am close to hanging the engine back on the mount,butI'm wondering if it would be worth putting any angle down or to the side kindalike a lot of Pipers have when I hang it? mines the GN-1 version with the Corvair.RaymondRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
OK as usual I'm sure this has been hashed over before.but I don't try to go intoarchives and hunt well.I am close to hanging the engine back on the mount,butI'm wondering if it would be worth putting any angle down or to the side kindalike a lot of Pipers have when I hang it? mines the GN-1 version with the Corvair.RaymondRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: "Douwe Blumberg"
"Is there a particular model year that is better suited for flight?"I would get the engine no matter. As far as counter balancing; it's really notneeded; no more RPM than the "A" turns with a prop. Better to get a 1928 forgedcrank; much stronger and lighter; counter-balance just adds weight and you don'tneed that. Will42Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
"Is there a particular model year that is better suited for flight?"I would get the engine no matter. As far as counter balancing; it's really notneeded; no more RPM than the "A" turns with a prop. Better to get a 1928 forgedcrank; much stronger and lighter; counter-balance just adds weight and you don'tneed that. Will42Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
I'm getting ready to place an order for my wood kit, and since I have to pay freight,I'd like to get as much stuff as I can on this order... especially allthe larger stuff that will require a freight truck. I know I've seen some discussion of parts lists on the boards, but I've searchedfor those threads and haven't come up with anything. As for the wood, I'vealready got all the capstrip for my wing ribs (only a few left to build), andI understand that in addition to the wood kit, I will need ply for gussets, floorand sides, as well as fuselage standoff material. I've identified severalthings that I'll need to order by studying the prints, but I'd hate to leavesomething out that I've overlooked, or order a part that should be substitutedwith something else. Does anyone have a parts list I can refer to prior to completing my order? Thanks!--------MarkRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 23:16:53 -0500Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
I'm getting ready to place an order for my wood kit, and since I have to pay freight,I'd like to get as much stuff as I can on this order... especially allthe larger stuff that will require a freight truck. I know I've seen some discussion of parts lists on the boards, but I've searchedfor those threads and haven't come up with anything. As for the wood, I'vealready got all the capstrip for my wing ribs (only a few left to build), andI understand that in addition to the wood kit, I will need ply for gussets, floorand sides, as well as fuselage standoff material. I've identified severalthings that I'll need to order by studying the prints, but I'd hate to leavesomething out that I've overlooked, or order a part that should be substitutedwith something else. Does anyone have a parts list I can refer to prior to completing my order? Thanks!--------MarkRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 23:16:53 -0500Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "bender"
Jeff,I had a nice visit with Bill a couple of weeks ago and he gave me permission toprint his starter information in an upcoming newsletter. I am thinking aboutadding it in the Fall issue.Best,-john-John HofmannVice-President, IT and ProductionThe Rees Group, Inc.2424 American LaneMadison, WI 53704Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150Fax: 608.443.2474Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.comOn Jun 6, 2014, at 3:30 PM, Boatright, Jeffrey wrote:> > Thanks much, John. This looks GREAT and reads even better!> > Doc Moshers piece about how various luminaries have contributed to the> Pietenpol co-op over the years was yet another great sentiment put to> words very well. I noted the mention of Bill Reweys Continental A-65> starter system. Does anyone have the newsletter issue that describes> that, and if so, can you scan it for me? I dont need it now (my C-85> already has a self-commencer), but Ive always been interested in ways of> using A-65s.> > Thanks,> > Jeff> > --> > Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD, FARVO> Professor of Ophthalmology> Emory University School of Medicine> > > > > On 6/5/14, 3:04 PM, "John Hofmann" wrote:> >> Hello Good People!>> >> While you await your printed copy, here is the latest pdf file to enjoy.>> My apologies on being even more tardy. I have a useless nephew who took>> his drug addiction to the next level and decided to become a>> quadriplegic. Given his immediate family shares the same moral fiber, my>> wife and I have had to arrange for his short term and long term care over>> the past couple of months. Lots of distractions.>> >> Now back to Pietenpols.>> >> -john-> > > ________________________________> > This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of> the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged> information. If the reader of this message is not the intended> recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution> or copying of this message (including any attachments) is strictly> prohibited.> > If you have received this message in error, please contact> the sender by reply e-mail message and destroy all copies of the> original message (including attachments).> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Jeff,I had a nice visit with Bill a couple of weeks ago and he gave me permission toprint his starter information in an upcoming newsletter. I am thinking aboutadding it in the Fall issue.Best,-john-John HofmannVice-President, IT and ProductionThe Rees Group, Inc.2424 American LaneMadison, WI 53704Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150Fax: 608.443.2474Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.comOn Jun 6, 2014, at 3:30 PM, Boatright, Jeffrey wrote:> > Thanks much, John. This looks GREAT and reads even better!> > Doc Moshers piece about how various luminaries have contributed to the> Pietenpol co-op over the years was yet another great sentiment put to> words very well. I noted the mention of Bill Reweys Continental A-65> starter system. Does anyone have the newsletter issue that describes> that, and if so, can you scan it for me? I dont need it now (my C-85> already has a self-commencer), but Ive always been interested in ways of> using A-65s.> > Thanks,> > Jeff> > --> > Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD, FARVO> Professor of Ophthalmology> Emory University School of Medicine> > > > > On 6/5/14, 3:04 PM, "John Hofmann" wrote:> >> Hello Good People!>> >> While you await your printed copy, here is the latest pdf file to enjoy.>> My apologies on being even more tardy. I have a useless nephew who took>> his drug addiction to the next level and decided to become a>> quadriplegic. Given his immediate family shares the same moral fiber, my>> wife and I have had to arrange for his short term and long term care over>> the past couple of months. Lots of distractions.>> >> Now back to Pietenpols.>> >> -john-> > > ________________________________> > This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of> the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged> information. If the reader of this message is not the intended> recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution> or copying of this message (including any attachments) is strictly> prohibited.> > If you have received this message in error, please contact> the sender by reply e-mail message and destroy all copies of the> original message (including attachments).> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: "Boatright, Jeffrey"
Hey guys..So I've been trying to get the courage to flay again after the last 2 glider ridesin the Piet..I did a full power run on the ground today and sure enough after 15 min or so rpmstarted falling and I saw a bit of smoke and shut it off.it sounds like the front bearing has no oil... nice tight sound and feel.it was at 160 deg and 9lbs of oil pressure.. pulling at 1800 rpm.modern pistons, insert bearings.. same engine builder as Dan.I'm feeling like a A65 may be in order.. bumming me outJeff faithRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Hey guys..So I've been trying to get the courage to flay again after the last 2 glider ridesin the Piet..I did a full power run on the ground today and sure enough after 15 min or so rpmstarted falling and I saw a bit of smoke and shut it off.it sounds like the front bearing has no oil... nice tight sound and feel.it was at 160 deg and 9lbs of oil pressure.. pulling at 1800 rpm.modern pistons, insert bearings.. same engine builder as Dan.I'm feeling like a A65 may be in order.. bumming me outJeff faithRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: John Fastnaught
I believe Jill's airplane is C-GGLU, may have been built by Lloyd Stamp beforeit was Adrian Meilleur's, and there are pictures of it under construction on theWestcoastpiet site under Adrian's name. From the pictures, it appears to bea very conventional split-gear landing gear setup with bungees for shock absorbing.My airplane has springs rather than bungees and the spring struts areself-limiting as to travel. I don't know how much travel the bungee setup shouldbe limited to.--------Oscar ZunigaMedford, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 powerRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
I believe Jill's airplane is C-GGLU, may have been built by Lloyd Stamp beforeit was Adrian Meilleur's, and there are pictures of it under construction on theWestcoastpiet site under Adrian's name. From the pictures, it appears to bea very conventional split-gear landing gear setup with bungees for shock absorbing.My airplane has springs rather than bungees and the spring struts areself-limiting as to travel. I don't know how much travel the bungee setup shouldbe limited to.--------Oscar ZunigaMedford, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 powerRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: danhelsper(at)aol.com
Hi Jeffi posted photos of the bolts - it really is neat to see how little was holdingthem in place! I'm really interested in seeing photos of how you resolved thesame issue. How many hours did you have on your Piet when those bolts failed?Thank youJillRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/2014 ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Hi Jeffi posted photos of the bolts - it really is neat to see how little was holdingthem in place! I'm really interested in seeing photos of how you resolved thesame issue. How many hours did you have on your Piet when those bolts failed?Thank youJillRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/2014 ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: "bender"
it is great but watch out. it may give you ideas about flying all over the U.S.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
it is great but watch out. it may give you ideas about flying all over the U.S.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: Tim White
I'm working on taking the engine off and tearing it down. .. it doesn't feel rightat all. I'll find the problem. With the oil pressure and temps I had I wouldthink it should have been fine. It's still tight after cooling down. . Andnoisy. JeffRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sun, 08 Jun 2014 12:42:25 -0400
I'm working on taking the engine off and tearing it down. .. it doesn't feel rightat all. I'll find the problem. With the oil pressure and temps I had I wouldthink it should have been fine. It's still tight after cooling down. . Andnoisy. JeffRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sun, 08 Jun 2014 12:42:25 -0400
Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: "tools"
The trailing edge spar of the horiz stab of 2RN was damaged in a ground loop incident.I've got pics somewhere of what it looked like before uncovering, notsure where they are, but suffice it to say, it seemed to indicate the same problemexactly.Upon removal and uncovering I found indeed the trailing edge was "cracked" andclearly some ribs were fouled up. The tail hit on one side as the plane rodeup on one wheel, also hitting a wing tip. Similar damage was observed externallyon the wing, in that ribs were upset. Turns out, in the wing, the spar was undamaged, but the spar in the horiz stabwas. This first pic shows the big picture (a bit out of order, I made a scarfcut) how the ribs were damaged which is really what was obvious externally.The spar damage itself is shown here. Makes one consider finishing the break andjust gluing the spar back together. While not quite a "fifteen to one" ratio,that sort of fix would indeed be clearly plenty strong. However, that spar crack is the least of the problems. Often referred to, probablynot often seen, is the infamous "compression fracture". First, look at therib failure. Clearly a rib broke that badly is now quite a bit shorter thanit was, in that it's going up and down a lot more than it's straight neighbors.That crack, while resting nearly where it was, clearly was quite a bit moreout of alignment during the failure. Look at this next picture sighting downalong the spar. You can just barely see how the spar is out of alignment.That one crack cannot allow that on its own, and you can see where the spar takesa turn inward...A much closer look reveals this little gem hiding under a rib. A little protrusionthat would be easy to miss. THAT is a compression fracture. The wood there has practically NO strength. Theobvious first crack really is pretty strong, but here, the wood is COMPLETELYcompromised and is essentially the same as a wind shake. Very much akin tocolumn buckling. It cannot be repaired at all, it simply has to be cut completelyout and replaced. This is a really nice example of it really, it could be quite a bit less obvious...which is why spar damage during any wing to ground contact is scary. Itreally may not be very obvious. Anyhoo, here's how I fixed it.Cleary, you have to scarf out the bad wood and replace it. To cut the scarf, Isimply used a decent sized back saw held by hand. It's very low tech but canbe done anywhere, I scarf cut all four of my fuse longerons to replace the tailpost in the same manner. Also did this to replace longeron sections wherethe main landing gear mounts after removing the belly skin. Once making the scarf cut in two places, I carved off the top gusset inboard andcarved out the old spar.These pics bring up a couple of worthwhile points. First, notice the gray wood?This airplane has spent NO appreciable time outdoors, ever. That's water intrustion.The bolts were corroded and there's evidence of water in the sparwhere the holes were. Second, you can see where the gusset did, and DID NOT have good glue joints. Whenyou lay tile floors, you spread the adhesive and lay the tile, and press itin. GOOD technique would then have you REMOVE the tile and inspect how wellthe adhesive (thinset) transferred to the tile. Less than 90 plus percent ofthe tile having some glue on it demonstrates poor technique. The same can besaid of ANY gluing operation, as tedious as it is. Third, you can see where some wood was never varnished. THIS IS EASY TO DO! However,water sitting in there, at the trailing edge of a stab, would easily causedry rot where it would NEVER be caught during any sort of inspection shortof uncovering after total dismantling. Food for thought.Cutting the replacement part is tricky. When tapers like this are involved, lengtherrors compound quickly. I milled up some extra spar material and made onehalf...Cut the other half...Used some common witness marks...To get a good pattern for the replacement part.The new part fit well and I was quite happy with the repair. Here's a pic of allthe new wood required to effect the repair:Repairs are always daunting because you have to undo something before making progress.In the end, it's ALWAYS faster than starting from scratch.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
The trailing edge spar of the horiz stab of 2RN was damaged in a ground loop incident.I've got pics somewhere of what it looked like before uncovering, notsure where they are, but suffice it to say, it seemed to indicate the same problemexactly.Upon removal and uncovering I found indeed the trailing edge was "cracked" andclearly some ribs were fouled up. The tail hit on one side as the plane rodeup on one wheel, also hitting a wing tip. Similar damage was observed externallyon the wing, in that ribs were upset. Turns out, in the wing, the spar was undamaged, but the spar in the horiz stabwas. This first pic shows the big picture (a bit out of order, I made a scarfcut) how the ribs were damaged which is really what was obvious externally.The spar damage itself is shown here. Makes one consider finishing the break andjust gluing the spar back together. While not quite a "fifteen to one" ratio,that sort of fix would indeed be clearly plenty strong. However, that spar crack is the least of the problems. Often referred to, probablynot often seen, is the infamous "compression fracture". First, look at therib failure. Clearly a rib broke that badly is now quite a bit shorter thanit was, in that it's going up and down a lot more than it's straight neighbors.That crack, while resting nearly where it was, clearly was quite a bit moreout of alignment during the failure. Look at this next picture sighting downalong the spar. You can just barely see how the spar is out of alignment.That one crack cannot allow that on its own, and you can see where the spar takesa turn inward...A much closer look reveals this little gem hiding under a rib. A little protrusionthat would be easy to miss. THAT is a compression fracture. The wood there has practically NO strength. Theobvious first crack really is pretty strong, but here, the wood is COMPLETELYcompromised and is essentially the same as a wind shake. Very much akin tocolumn buckling. It cannot be repaired at all, it simply has to be cut completelyout and replaced. This is a really nice example of it really, it could be quite a bit less obvious...which is why spar damage during any wing to ground contact is scary. Itreally may not be very obvious. Anyhoo, here's how I fixed it.Cleary, you have to scarf out the bad wood and replace it. To cut the scarf, Isimply used a decent sized back saw held by hand. It's very low tech but canbe done anywhere, I scarf cut all four of my fuse longerons to replace the tailpost in the same manner. Also did this to replace longeron sections wherethe main landing gear mounts after removing the belly skin. Once making the scarf cut in two places, I carved off the top gusset inboard andcarved out the old spar.These pics bring up a couple of worthwhile points. First, notice the gray wood?This airplane has spent NO appreciable time outdoors, ever. That's water intrustion.The bolts were corroded and there's evidence of water in the sparwhere the holes were. Second, you can see where the gusset did, and DID NOT have good glue joints. Whenyou lay tile floors, you spread the adhesive and lay the tile, and press itin. GOOD technique would then have you REMOVE the tile and inspect how wellthe adhesive (thinset) transferred to the tile. Less than 90 plus percent ofthe tile having some glue on it demonstrates poor technique. The same can besaid of ANY gluing operation, as tedious as it is. Third, you can see where some wood was never varnished. THIS IS EASY TO DO! However,water sitting in there, at the trailing edge of a stab, would easily causedry rot where it would NEVER be caught during any sort of inspection shortof uncovering after total dismantling. Food for thought.Cutting the replacement part is tricky. When tapers like this are involved, lengtherrors compound quickly. I milled up some extra spar material and made onehalf...Cut the other half...Used some common witness marks...To get a good pattern for the replacement part.The new part fit well and I was quite happy with the repair. Here's a pic of allthe new wood required to effect the repair:Repairs are always daunting because you have to undo something before making progress.In the end, it's ALWAYS faster than starting from scratch.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: "bender"
In my application I utilized the GAV (Gas Adjusting Valve) on the Zenith carburetorfor a choke (as is done in the automobile). I added a spring to keep theflapper-valve open during normal operation and I have a bit of hose cut to thecorrect length and split down the side that I place on the exposed shaft ofthe GAV to keep the choke on (while priming) and then remove the hose before makingthe ignition hot and place it on the outer shell of the throttle cable forstorage during operation. My routine is flour blades choked, four blades moreto suck the juice up into the manifold, make it hot and start.The enclosed picture was taken before the mixture was set and the GAV shaft safetiedso it could not turn (or rotate).Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/chok ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
In my application I utilized the GAV (Gas Adjusting Valve) on the Zenith carburetorfor a choke (as is done in the automobile). I added a spring to keep theflapper-valve open during normal operation and I have a bit of hose cut to thecorrect length and split down the side that I place on the exposed shaft ofthe GAV to keep the choke on (while priming) and then remove the hose before makingthe ignition hot and place it on the outer shell of the throttle cable forstorage during operation. My routine is flour blades choked, four blades moreto suck the juice up into the manifold, make it hot and start.The enclosed picture was taken before the mixture was set and the GAV shaft safetiedso it could not turn (or rotate).Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/chok ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: "Chris Rusch"
So the engine is out and torn down and I have a piston scored on all 4 "corners"last time this happened it was the #4 piston now the #1 piston. the #2 pistonhas a bit of wear down both sides if the skirt the I have 283 chevy pistonsand insert rods and mains. I understand this is a sign of heat problems. thewater temp never got to 170... I just measured the clearance with a piston anda feeler gage and can just get a .003 between the piston and the wall... I readthat I should have .005-.007.. I think the bore may be too tightany thoughtsJeff FaithLou KYRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
So the engine is out and torn down and I have a piston scored on all 4 "corners"last time this happened it was the #4 piston now the #1 piston. the #2 pistonhas a bit of wear down both sides if the skirt the I have 283 chevy pistonsand insert rods and mains. I understand this is a sign of heat problems. thewater temp never got to 170... I just measured the clearance with a piston anda feeler gage and can just get a .003 between the piston and the wall... I readthat I should have .005-.007.. I think the bore may be too tightany thoughtsJeff FaithLou KYRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: "tools"
Maybe a steam pocket in the cylinder walls?--------NX321LRNow test flying!!Mitsubishi PoweredRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Maybe a steam pocket in the cylinder walls?--------NX321LRNow test flying!!Mitsubishi PoweredRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: "bender"
Oh ya, that was a $100 table saw we bought for my son. My table saw was buriedbeneath a wing!Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Oh ya, that was a $100 table saw we bought for my son. My table saw was buriedbeneath a wing!Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A
Original Posted By: Charles Burkholder
I did measure at the skirt.. widest point..and 3 thousandths almost wouldn't go.read that .005-.007 was normal .. I only have half that. 2 pistons need to bereplaced in may opinion so prob do all four, and thinking I'll take it to ashop and have them bore 3 or four thousandths. and confirm roundness. I have a pretty large "steam" pipe in the front of the head..last time this happened to the rear cylinder now the front.. I'm guessing waterflow and steam problem wouldn't move around.thanks gentlemanJeff FaithRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2014 16:51:07 -0500
I did measure at the skirt.. widest point..and 3 thousandths almost wouldn't go.read that .005-.007 was normal .. I only have half that. 2 pistons need to bereplaced in may opinion so prob do all four, and thinking I'll take it to ashop and have them bore 3 or four thousandths. and confirm roundness. I have a pretty large "steam" pipe in the front of the head..last time this happened to the rear cylinder now the front.. I'm guessing waterflow and steam problem wouldn't move around.thanks gentlemanJeff FaithRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2014 16:51:07 -0500
Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
Original Posted By: danhelsper(at)aol.com
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________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A
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________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A