Original Posted By: "glad2fly"
Are a gaggle of us flying up to Osh again this year on Sunday? I'd like to trailalong, this will be my first time flying into Osh. Always drove previously.Got N30PP back up and running. Did the annual with my A&P and found the exhaustvalve in the #1 cylinder on the Cont A-75 wasn't seating. Pulled the jug andfound the seat eroding away. Valve work meant the normal cheap annual wasn't quiteso cheap this year.Funny watching the A&P's face when he realized that I put almost 70 hours on 30PPin the last 12 months - 6 of which were spent on the ground due to lousy weather.Waaayyy too much fun...Looking forward to seeing the group again, and especially Jack's Braut's. The 16year old son had so much fun last year that he's coming back again this year.Hide your daughters... :)Lorin MillerGN-1 N30PPWaiex N81YX - almost in the air...Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "tools"
I'm interested in the plane, maybe building it. If there was a thread that explainedthe various "kits" and methods of creating the shapes I would appreciateit. I'm not a woodworker.Also, regarding "kits." I understand that the Pietenpol design is more or lessa scratch build. It seems like some entrepreur would have already created a wholekit with all the parts to sell though. I'd much be flying sooner than laterand pay someone for the leg work. Or if there were a list of parts and wherethey can be found thread that would be helpful. I know there's a lot on thissite but it's piecemeal...or maybe I just haven't read enough yet.Is there a model that I can build that would give me a idea of what the biggerproject is all about?I've got a ton of questions and will try to find the answers here before postingthe obvious....I hope.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
I'm interested in the plane, maybe building it. If there was a thread that explainedthe various "kits" and methods of creating the shapes I would appreciateit. I'm not a woodworker.Also, regarding "kits." I understand that the Pietenpol design is more or lessa scratch build. It seems like some entrepreur would have already created a wholekit with all the parts to sell though. I'd much be flying sooner than laterand pay someone for the leg work. Or if there were a list of parts and wherethey can be found thread that would be helpful. I know there's a lot on thissite but it's piecemeal...or maybe I just haven't read enough yet.Is there a model that I can build that would give me a idea of what the biggerproject is all about?I've got a ton of questions and will try to find the answers here before postingthe obvious....I hope.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "Billy McCaskill"
Wow, loaded question!First, it's not KINDA scratchbuilt, it IS scratchbuilt. Many have tried over theyears to offer parts, and some still do, but there's just no money in it, soit's never escalated to an entire kit.That being said, there are LOTS AND LOTS of projects out there just waiting forsomeone to finish them. There are LOTS of planes out there, terribly out ofdate, annual, some damage and never fixed, etc, that are essentially kits.Many will tell you to be wary, because you don't know the quality of build, blahblah blah. BUT, if you consider the price of the pieces you are getting thatyou CAN verify (turnbuckles, gear, brakes, engines, props, control horns, shackles,instruments, etc) and it's a good deal, then if you can reuse a fuse,tail feathers, wing, spar, whatever, it's just bonus.I recently had an opportunity to buy and ENTIRE FLYABLE (saw it fly!) Piet forsix grand. Can't come close to buying the parts for that.So, there's something to start with. Actual building advice is definitely piecemealin the newsletters and here, but there's a few good vids that are worthgetting to help you start your research.Welcome aboard. Consider attending Brodhead as a good place to start.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Wow, loaded question!First, it's not KINDA scratchbuilt, it IS scratchbuilt. Many have tried over theyears to offer parts, and some still do, but there's just no money in it, soit's never escalated to an entire kit.That being said, there are LOTS AND LOTS of projects out there just waiting forsomeone to finish them. There are LOTS of planes out there, terribly out ofdate, annual, some damage and never fixed, etc, that are essentially kits.Many will tell you to be wary, because you don't know the quality of build, blahblah blah. BUT, if you consider the price of the pieces you are getting thatyou CAN verify (turnbuckles, gear, brakes, engines, props, control horns, shackles,instruments, etc) and it's a good deal, then if you can reuse a fuse,tail feathers, wing, spar, whatever, it's just bonus.I recently had an opportunity to buy and ENTIRE FLYABLE (saw it fly!) Piet forsix grand. Can't come close to buying the parts for that.So, there's something to start with. Actual building advice is definitely piecemealin the newsletters and here, but there's a few good vids that are worthgetting to help you start your research.Welcome aboard. Consider attending Brodhead as a good place to start.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "glad2fly"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?> > Hello nameless question-poster,> > An entrepreneur DID create kits of parts to build entire Pietenpol aircraft,but to order one of those kits, you'll first need to get yourself a > working time machine. The kits were sold by a fellow named Bernard > Pietenpol, about 75 years ago.> The only real fast track to getting airborne in a Piet is to buy > yourself a flying one, or buy someone's nearly completed project. > Otherwise, it's going to require about 2000 hours of build time. > You don't need to be a master woodworker, but you do need to have > some basic woodworking skills and tools - it is a wooden plane, > after all. You will also need to have (or learn) metalworking > skills, since there are a considerable number of metal parts on > this "all wood" aircraft. You will also need to learn how to weld, > or learn how to pay someone to do your welding for you.> The Pietenpol is one of the least expensive "real" aircraft you can > build. But that's because the hours of work that go into building > one are never entered into the equation. If you keep your hourly > "wage" down around one dollar per hour, you can probably make money > building and selling parts.> In short... there are no short cuts. If your main goal is to get > into the air quickly, the Pietenpol probably isn't the right choice > for a project. If, on the other hand, your goal is to build an > aircraft with your bare hands (and a few power tools), and to be > able to say "I built every part of this machine myself", and learn > numerous skills along the way, then this is the plane to build.> > Bill C.> > > Bill C.> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 825#377825> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?> > Hello nameless question-poster,> > An entrepreneur DID create kits of parts to build entire Pietenpol aircraft,but to order one of those kits, you'll first need to get yourself a > working time machine. The kits were sold by a fellow named Bernard > Pietenpol, about 75 years ago.> The only real fast track to getting airborne in a Piet is to buy > yourself a flying one, or buy someone's nearly completed project. > Otherwise, it's going to require about 2000 hours of build time. > You don't need to be a master woodworker, but you do need to have > some basic woodworking skills and tools - it is a wooden plane, > after all. You will also need to have (or learn) metalworking > skills, since there are a considerable number of metal parts on > this "all wood" aircraft. You will also need to learn how to weld, > or learn how to pay someone to do your welding for you.> The Pietenpol is one of the least expensive "real" aircraft you can > build. But that's because the hours of work that go into building > one are never entered into the equation. If you keep your hourly > "wage" down around one dollar per hour, you can probably make money > building and selling parts.> In short... there are no short cuts. If your main goal is to get > into the air quickly, the Pietenpol probably isn't the right choice > for a project. If, on the other hand, your goal is to build an > aircraft with your bare hands (and a few power tools), and to be > able to say "I built every part of this machine myself", and learn > numerous skills along the way, then this is the plane to build.> > Bill C.> > > Bill C.> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 825#377825> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "Bill Church"
You can always send them to me as I am driving up.--------John FrancisRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
You can always send them to me as I am driving up.--------John FrancisRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB"
Hello nameless question-poster,An entrepreneur DID create kits of parts to build entire Pietenpol aircraft, butto order one of those kits, you'll first need to get yourself a working timemachine. The kits were sold by a fellow named Bernard Pietenpol, about 75 yearsago.The only real fast track to getting airborne in a Piet is to buy yourself a flyingone, or buy someone's nearly completed project. Otherwise, it's going torequire about 2000 hours of build time. You don't need to be a master woodworker,but you do need to have some basic woodworking skills and tools - it is awooden plane, after all. You will also need to have (or learn) metalworkingskills, since there are a considerable number of metal parts on this "all wood"aircraft. You will also need to learn how to weld, or learn how to pay someoneto do your welding for you.The Pietenpol is one of the least expensive "real" aircraft you can build. Butthat's because the hours of work that go into building one are never enteredinto the equation. If you keep your hourly "wage" down around one dollar perhour, you can probably make money building and selling parts.In short... there are no short cuts. If your main goal is to get into the airquickly, the Pietenpol probably isn't the right choice for a project. If, onthe other hand, your goal is to build an aircraft with your bare hands (and afew power tools), and to be able to say "I built every part of this machine myself",and learn numerous skills along the way, then this is the plane to build.Bill C.Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Hello nameless question-poster,An entrepreneur DID create kits of parts to build entire Pietenpol aircraft, butto order one of those kits, you'll first need to get yourself a working timemachine. The kits were sold by a fellow named Bernard Pietenpol, about 75 yearsago.The only real fast track to getting airborne in a Piet is to buy yourself a flyingone, or buy someone's nearly completed project. Otherwise, it's going torequire about 2000 hours of build time. You don't need to be a master woodworker,but you do need to have some basic woodworking skills and tools - it is awooden plane, after all. You will also need to have (or learn) metalworkingskills, since there are a considerable number of metal parts on this "all wood"aircraft. You will also need to learn how to weld, or learn how to pay someoneto do your welding for you.The Pietenpol is one of the least expensive "real" aircraft you can build. Butthat's because the hours of work that go into building one are never enteredinto the equation. If you keep your hourly "wage" down around one dollar perhour, you can probably make money building and selling parts.In short... there are no short cuts. If your main goal is to get into the airquickly, the Pietenpol probably isn't the right choice for a project. If, onthe other hand, your goal is to build an aircraft with your bare hands (and afew power tools), and to be able to say "I built every part of this machine myself",and learn numerous skills along the way, then this is the plane to build.Bill C.Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: Bill Church
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?Just for a frame of reference. 2000 hours is 40 hours per week for a full yearminus a 2 week vacation. So Really a full work year. Or 20 hours per week for two years minus a month off. So every weekend for twoyears.I was looking at kits that claimed 500 hours of construction time up through thosethat said 2500 hours. I had no idea what that meant so I did the math basedon a work week.Blue Skies,Steve D----- Original Message -----
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?Just for a frame of reference. 2000 hours is 40 hours per week for a full yearminus a 2 week vacation. So Really a full work year. Or 20 hours per week for two years minus a month off. So every weekend for twoyears.I was looking at kits that claimed 500 hours of construction time up through thosethat said 2500 hours. I had no idea what that meant so I did the math basedon a work week.Blue Skies,Steve D----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "bubbleboy"
I do still have a set of the fittings for the flappy things elevator rudder etc.I am allmost ready to cut out the .063 bits for the pulley brackets and the restof the flappie things fittings. The GRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
I do still have a set of the fittings for the flappy things elevator rudder etc.I am allmost ready to cut out the .063 bits for the pulley brackets and the restof the flappie things fittings. The GRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Hi George...email me with what you got! I am making the control system right nowand swinging a hacksaw around the garage.Scotty--------Tamworth, AustraliaBuilding a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camperwww.scottyspietenpol.comTail and Ribs built...Building control system and about to start fuselage...Corvairengine at Roy's Garage waiting to be modified.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2012 07:20:10 -0700 (PDT)
Hi George...email me with what you got! I am making the control system right nowand swinging a hacksaw around the garage.Scotty--------Tamworth, AustraliaBuilding a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camperwww.scottyspietenpol.comTail and Ribs built...Building control system and about to start fuselage...Corvairengine at Roy's Garage waiting to be modified.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2012 07:20:10 -0700 (PDT)
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "Jack Phillips"
wow, interesting responseRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
wow, interesting responseRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Perhaps I can answer some of your questions, since I have built a Pietenpoland am now building an RV-10. There are some interesting comparisonsbetween the two:Item Pietenpol RV-10Hours to Build 2500 2500New Skills to learn >10 1 (riveting)Cruise Speed 65 mph 200 mph# of seats 2 4Cost to Build $15,000 $135,000 (typ)Cost to Fly $20/hr $85/hrNumber of Everybody Nobodypeople who willcome out on theramp to seeyour new planeIn short, I thoroughly enjoyed the build process with my Pietenpol. Ilearned a huge number of new skills (including wood-working, welding,metal-cutting, jig-building, rigging, fabric covering, painting, riveting,sheet-metal work, wiring, engine building, aircraft assembly, etc). TheRV-10 on the other hand I find tedious. The main skill required is riveting(there are over 25,000 rivets in an RV-10, and each requires clecoing,match-drilling, unclecoing, deburring, dimpling (if for a flush rivet),reclecoing and finally either squeezing or bucking the rivet). All the funpart of the job is done for you by the factory. You get to do the tediousgrunt work of assembly. Oh, and there's the cost. Van's touts an "expectedbuild price" of about $75,000 for an RV-10, but so far I don't know of asingle one that has been built for less than $125,000. My goal is to be thefirst to build one for under $100K.I will enjoy travelling in the RV-10 whenever I get it finished, but it willnever have my heart like my Pietenpol does. Don't get me wrong - RV's aregreat airplanes. I have an RV-4 and used it this weekend for my wife and meto fly up near Buffalo NY, where we visited with Rob Busch (an excellentPietenpol builder) and toured Niagara Falls. Now I'm back home in Virginiaafter only 2.5 hours of flying time - you can't do that in a Pietenpol. IfI go to Brodhead this year, it will be in the RV-4 because I can make thetrip in 4 hours, vs 14 hours and an overnight stay in a hotel in thePietenpol. But it won't be anywhere near as much fun.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----
Perhaps I can answer some of your questions, since I have built a Pietenpoland am now building an RV-10. There are some interesting comparisonsbetween the two:Item Pietenpol RV-10Hours to Build 2500 2500New Skills to learn >10 1 (riveting)Cruise Speed 65 mph 200 mph# of seats 2 4Cost to Build $15,000 $135,000 (typ)Cost to Fly $20/hr $85/hrNumber of Everybody Nobodypeople who willcome out on theramp to seeyour new planeIn short, I thoroughly enjoyed the build process with my Pietenpol. Ilearned a huge number of new skills (including wood-working, welding,metal-cutting, jig-building, rigging, fabric covering, painting, riveting,sheet-metal work, wiring, engine building, aircraft assembly, etc). TheRV-10 on the other hand I find tedious. The main skill required is riveting(there are over 25,000 rivets in an RV-10, and each requires clecoing,match-drilling, unclecoing, deburring, dimpling (if for a flush rivet),reclecoing and finally either squeezing or bucking the rivet). All the funpart of the job is done for you by the factory. You get to do the tediousgrunt work of assembly. Oh, and there's the cost. Van's touts an "expectedbuild price" of about $75,000 for an RV-10, but so far I don't know of asingle one that has been built for less than $125,000. My goal is to be thefirst to build one for under $100K.I will enjoy travelling in the RV-10 whenever I get it finished, but it willnever have my heart like my Pietenpol does. Don't get me wrong - RV's aregreat airplanes. I have an RV-4 and used it this weekend for my wife and meto fly up near Buffalo NY, where we visited with Rob Busch (an excellentPietenpol builder) and toured Niagara Falls. Now I'm back home in Virginiaafter only 2.5 hours of flying time - you can't do that in a Pietenpol. IfI go to Brodhead this year, it will be in the RV-4 because I can make thetrip in 4 hours, vs 14 hours and an overnight stay in a hotel in thePietenpol. But it won't be anywhere near as much fun.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Actually, building two at the same time would make sense, if there were aserious market for a Pietenpol. The guy that got me into the EAA back inthe early 70's was building two Pitts Specials. He sold one and made enoughon it to pay for both. You couldn't do that with a Pietenpol. I've got$15,000 and 8 years work in mine, and if I sold it I might be able to get$15,000 for it, but I doubt it.In building mine, I probably made enough parts (particularly the metalfittings) for 1-1/2 Piets. It would have been pretty easy to just maketwice as many parts since you are already up on the learning curve. Butdon't do it thinking there's a market for the parts, or the airplane.The best way is probably to get a bunch of friends together and buildseveral Pietenpols simultaneously, as the "Big Piet" builders in Georgia dida few years ago. A kit has never been popular for Pietenpols since no two Pietenpols are thesame. People modify them to suit their purposes, and a kit doesn't lenditself to such activity. Just quit worrying about it and start building.In the time you've spent online discussing various kit options you couldhave had your rib jig built and a couple of ribs produced. Buy the TonyBingelis books, the EAA Wood Aircraft Construction book, the EAA AircraftWelding book and then start making sawdust.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----
Actually, building two at the same time would make sense, if there were aserious market for a Pietenpol. The guy that got me into the EAA back inthe early 70's was building two Pitts Specials. He sold one and made enoughon it to pay for both. You couldn't do that with a Pietenpol. I've got$15,000 and 8 years work in mine, and if I sold it I might be able to get$15,000 for it, but I doubt it.In building mine, I probably made enough parts (particularly the metalfittings) for 1-1/2 Piets. It would have been pretty easy to just maketwice as many parts since you are already up on the learning curve. Butdon't do it thinking there's a market for the parts, or the airplane.The best way is probably to get a bunch of friends together and buildseveral Pietenpols simultaneously, as the "Big Piet" builders in Georgia dida few years ago. A kit has never been popular for Pietenpols since no two Pietenpols are thesame. People modify them to suit their purposes, and a kit doesn't lenditself to such activity. Just quit worrying about it and start building.In the time you've spent online discussing various kit options you couldhave had your rib jig built and a couple of ribs produced. Buy the TonyBingelis books, the EAA Wood Aircraft Construction book, the EAA AircraftWelding book and then start making sawdust.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: Gerry Holland
rib kit....here's what I see on aircraftspruce.com...http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/k ... mper.phpno rib kit listed.And it looks like the kits are mainly capstrips. Even though builders like to customizethere seem to be some parts that are standard. I don't know what elseto buy but capstrips I guess. If there was a spruce stock for the blankety blankkit I'd understand a little better.I know I need to buy the plans and I might be making this more difficult than itneeds to be but geez, like a lot of things, the darn wheel has to be reinvented...interms of what steps to take. If anyone has to respond to this commentother than agree with me it's because they already got it figured out and thinkI'm whining about it.And why does someone put in 2500 hrs and spends $15K to only have a plane worth$15K? That's ridiculous. Maybe people don't want Pietenpols. I can't understandthat because it's a darn cool plane.It's pretty clear than building it gives a person a lot of satisfaction but lookingat the cost of it....it makes more sense to buy someone elses.JamieRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
rib kit....here's what I see on aircraftspruce.com...http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/k ... mper.phpno rib kit listed.And it looks like the kits are mainly capstrips. Even though builders like to customizethere seem to be some parts that are standard. I don't know what elseto buy but capstrips I guess. If there was a spruce stock for the blankety blankkit I'd understand a little better.I know I need to buy the plans and I might be making this more difficult than itneeds to be but geez, like a lot of things, the darn wheel has to be reinvented...interms of what steps to take. If anyone has to respond to this commentother than agree with me it's because they already got it figured out and thinkI'm whining about it.And why does someone put in 2500 hrs and spends $15K to only have a plane worth$15K? That's ridiculous. Maybe people don't want Pietenpols. I can't understandthat because it's a darn cool plane.It's pretty clear than building it gives a person a lot of satisfaction but lookingat the cost of it....it makes more sense to buy someone elses.JamieRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "glad2fly"
JamieI'm confused at your various rationale.Should you actually be thinking of building a Piet and any kit from scratch? Probably not.The wheel doesn't need re-inventing as the Pietenpol aircraft objective is to build an aircraft from scratch as per the design plans and then fly.YOU can change things if you want but it wont be as per plans but that is the beauty of this pastime. Make an Airplane that appeals to you and live with it.Again I'm sorry to say I'm confused and that leads me to form an opinion that may or may not be correct but....you're whining and I don't know why or what about?And why does someone put in 2500 hrs and spends $15K to only have a plane worth $15K? That's ridiculous.If you are building to make a profit then you are in cloud cuckoo land! The journey for most of us that build is as important as the destination or value.It's pretty clear thant building it gives a person a lot of satisfaction but looking at the cost of it....it makes more sense to buy someone else's.In your case definitely. There are good kit or scratch built aircraft for sale all the time. Go for it.Gerry________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
JamieI'm confused at your various rationale.Should you actually be thinking of building a Piet and any kit from scratch? Probably not.The wheel doesn't need re-inventing as the Pietenpol aircraft objective is to build an aircraft from scratch as per the design plans and then fly.YOU can change things if you want but it wont be as per plans but that is the beauty of this pastime. Make an Airplane that appeals to you and live with it.Again I'm sorry to say I'm confused and that leads me to form an opinion that may or may not be correct but....you're whining and I don't know why or what about?And why does someone put in 2500 hrs and spends $15K to only have a plane worth $15K? That's ridiculous.If you are building to make a profit then you are in cloud cuckoo land! The journey for most of us that build is as important as the destination or value.It's pretty clear thant building it gives a person a lot of satisfaction but looking at the cost of it....it makes more sense to buy someone else's.In your case definitely. There are good kit or scratch built aircraft for sale all the time. Go for it.Gerry________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "Douwe Blumberg"
Thanks Earl. I'll look for that thread and if I find it I'll post it here also.JamieRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Thanks Earl. I'll look for that thread and if I find it I'll post it here also.JamieRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Jamie,Check out http://www.cpc-world.com.I have a material list on the web site that should help.CheersPeterWonthaggi Australiahttp://www.cpc-world.com-----Original Message-----
Jamie,Check out http://www.cpc-world.com.I have a material list on the web site that should help.CheersPeterWonthaggi Australiahttp://www.cpc-world.com-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: AMsafetyC(at)aol.com
Peter, your site is going to be incredibly useful! Don't take it down (I'm goingto copy the site for my own use just in case). Thanks for that. Your Pietenpolwas very classy looking. I'm nosy, how much did you sell it for if you cansay....and if you can't, did you get any sweat equity from the sale? Your Zodiac looks like an RV. What was your inspiration for that plane?Thanks,JamieRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Peter, your site is going to be incredibly useful! Don't take it down (I'm goingto copy the site for my own use just in case). Thanks for that. Your Pietenpolwas very classy looking. I'm nosy, how much did you sell it for if you cansay....and if you can't, did you get any sweat equity from the sale? Your Zodiac looks like an RV. What was your inspiration for that plane?Thanks,JamieRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "K5YAC"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?I went to the lumber yard, a real live lumber yard and pulled form the racks yellow poplar planks that were rough sawn mill cuts ranging from 1 1/2 to 2 inch thick 12 feet long and 6 to 8 inches wide. I had it planed on 3 sides and brought down to 5 quarter and 1" thick material.I fed those planks through my 10" table saw and from them I cut out my longerons, lateral and diagonal supports. Tail strips leading and trailing edges and the spars, not to mention a bunch of smaller pieces for jigs, hold downs and work pieces. I believe my first order was right around 70.00 dollars.Those 4 planks kept me busy for months building my Piet.JohnNX895JR reserved________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?I went to the lumber yard, a real live lumber yard and pulled form the racks yellow poplar planks that were rough sawn mill cuts ranging from 1 1/2 to 2 inch thick 12 feet long and 6 to 8 inches wide. I had it planed on 3 sides and brought down to 5 quarter and 1" thick material.I fed those planks through my 10" table saw and from them I cut out my longerons, lateral and diagonal supports. Tail strips leading and trailing edges and the spars, not to mention a bunch of smaller pieces for jigs, hold downs and work pieces. I believe my first order was right around 70.00 dollars.Those 4 planks kept me busy for months building my Piet.JohnNX895JR reserved________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "cjborsuk"
glad2fly wrote:> Peter, your site is going to be incredibly useful! Don't take it down (I'm goingto copy the site for my own use just in case).You would have probably been directed to several other "incredibly useful" sitesor threads if you weren't dead set on locating the non-existent Pietenpol kit,or telling one of our more respected contributors how ridiculous he is. Someonetold you along the way that it is about the journey... those of us withpatience get that. Why does that make it worth it? Well, that is something thatyou will have to discover for yourself... but primarily its because you CAN'Tbuy this airplane in a box. All of them are hand made... some more than others.If you hang around long enough you'll figure out what that means.There are times where you might be able to farm out work... for a part, or a skillthat you just don't posses, or perhaps not to the level necessary or desired,but for the most part, you will have to look at the big puzzle, figure outa process that makes sense, choose a part and start making your materials looklike the picture. It is fun, challenging, frustrating, rewarding, maddening,exhilarating and a variety of other emotions as the journey progresses. Theother day I got to sit back and look at an assembly that I had struggled withon and off for months... to me, it finally looked fabulous... very rewarding.I sat and drank a couple of beers and just looked at it from all angles... yep,well worth all the frustration when you finally figure something out thathas stumped you for a long time. Those are the little rewards that make it allworth while, and from what I hear there are many more rewards that I can't evenimagine... I'm working my way there. In addition to that, the people in thisgroup are fantastic. You haven't just stumbled onto a group of simple mindedwooden airplane builders... there are people of all walks here... people whohave built several airplanes... some highly educated... but for all of us,this process is an educational experience. We are all teachers and students.It really is a lot of fun.We all share the same goal... a desire to fly our own handcrafted machine. Whenthat actually happens isn't quite as important as you might think. If you chooseto set out on that journey, all of the comments in this thread will startto make sense. It wasn't that long ago that I started my project... but I cantell you that a nearly unnoticeable change occurred where I just settled inand accepted that this was going to take a while, and that I better just enjoyit while I can.--------Mark ChouinardWings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing GearRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
glad2fly wrote:> Peter, your site is going to be incredibly useful! Don't take it down (I'm goingto copy the site for my own use just in case).You would have probably been directed to several other "incredibly useful" sitesor threads if you weren't dead set on locating the non-existent Pietenpol kit,or telling one of our more respected contributors how ridiculous he is. Someonetold you along the way that it is about the journey... those of us withpatience get that. Why does that make it worth it? Well, that is something thatyou will have to discover for yourself... but primarily its because you CAN'Tbuy this airplane in a box. All of them are hand made... some more than others.If you hang around long enough you'll figure out what that means.There are times where you might be able to farm out work... for a part, or a skillthat you just don't posses, or perhaps not to the level necessary or desired,but for the most part, you will have to look at the big puzzle, figure outa process that makes sense, choose a part and start making your materials looklike the picture. It is fun, challenging, frustrating, rewarding, maddening,exhilarating and a variety of other emotions as the journey progresses. Theother day I got to sit back and look at an assembly that I had struggled withon and off for months... to me, it finally looked fabulous... very rewarding.I sat and drank a couple of beers and just looked at it from all angles... yep,well worth all the frustration when you finally figure something out thathas stumped you for a long time. Those are the little rewards that make it allworth while, and from what I hear there are many more rewards that I can't evenimagine... I'm working my way there. In addition to that, the people in thisgroup are fantastic. You haven't just stumbled onto a group of simple mindedwooden airplane builders... there are people of all walks here... people whohave built several airplanes... some highly educated... but for all of us,this process is an educational experience. We are all teachers and students.It really is a lot of fun.We all share the same goal... a desire to fly our own handcrafted machine. Whenthat actually happens isn't quite as important as you might think. If you chooseto set out on that journey, all of the comments in this thread will startto make sense. It wasn't that long ago that I started my project... but I cantell you that a nearly unnoticeable change occurred where I just settled inand accepted that this was going to take a while, and that I better just enjoyit while I can.--------Mark ChouinardWings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing GearRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: Gene Rambo
Jamie,There is some great advice that has come your way. Take it to heart. No offense,but it does not sound like a Pietenpol is your plane. You need to look at thefull kits. The RV12 might be a good fit.Mark - great points. Look forward to sharing a cold one together in Brodhead. ChuckRaleigh NCRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Jamie,There is some great advice that has come your way. Take it to heart. No offense,but it does not sound like a Pietenpol is your plane. You need to look at thefull kits. The RV12 might be a good fit.Mark - great points. Look forward to sharing a cold one together in Brodhead. ChuckRaleigh NCRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Jamie,As mentioned in previous emails on the list, there was no sweat equity. Thesale price didn't even cover the build costs. I did end up with a load ofexperience in different aspects of wooden airplane construction and a wholebunch of new friends on this list.I built and fly the Zodiac because my local airport has a lot of "turn thekey and fly" pilots. With the Piet I had to get changed in some warm gear,wait for some good weather and go fly. Not quite so convenient. My wife isnot a particularly good passenger but she did fly with me in the Piet, once.There have been many more flights in the Zodiac.The Zodiac is a nice plane and I enjoyed building it but it doesn't havewhat a Piet has, character!I had often thought of building another Piet and when the opportunity aroseto buy a damaged Piet at a good price, I jumped at it. It will berefurbished /repaired with (I hope) the same love and care as the originalbuilder bestowed upon it. Now if the shipping company would justcooperate!!!!!!!!!CheersPeterWonthaggi Australiahttp://www.cpc-world.com-----Original Message-----
Jamie,As mentioned in previous emails on the list, there was no sweat equity. Thesale price didn't even cover the build costs. I did end up with a load ofexperience in different aspects of wooden airplane construction and a wholebunch of new friends on this list.I built and fly the Zodiac because my local airport has a lot of "turn thekey and fly" pilots. With the Piet I had to get changed in some warm gear,wait for some good weather and go fly. Not quite so convenient. My wife isnot a particularly good passenger but she did fly with me in the Piet, once.There have been many more flights in the Zodiac.The Zodiac is a nice plane and I enjoyed building it but it doesn't havewhat a Piet has, character!I had often thought of building another Piet and when the opportunity aroseto buy a damaged Piet at a good price, I jumped at it. It will berefurbished /repaired with (I hope) the same love and care as the originalbuilder bestowed upon it. Now if the shipping company would justcooperate!!!!!!!!!CheersPeterWonthaggi Australiahttp://www.cpc-world.com-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "skipgadd(at)earthlink.net"
Hey Jamie,There are lots of Piet models out there too, however, I wouldn't consider any ofthose useful for insight into building a piet. The design IS particularly wellsuited for duplicating in 1/3 or 1/4 scale, which would give you an idea ofhow one goes together.Years ago I saw a 1/4 scale model a ford on ebay... THAT would be cool!>From what I gather about your point of view, finding a partial complete is probablya good way for you to go. While ALL homebuilts have uniqueness, there area couple of aspects about the Piet which are more substantial than most otherdesigns. Primarily the engine, fuse length and gear. I'd highly recommendBrodhead or just finding some other venue with examples of these differencesso you can determine how close to the configuration you desire, the project wouldbe, which will help you determine it's worth to you.I'll dig around and see if I can find the contact info the Piet I referred to earlier.I'd have bought it, but timing was bad. I bought a flying Piet lastyear as well (hope to have it at brodhead) which was EXACTLY the configurationI wanted save the engine (though since I've decided it's definitely the engineI want, an A-65). I think it was a great way to go, my son (now 18yrs) andI are really having the time of our lives with the plane, and it's firmly cementingin my mind, the configuration of the plane I am building.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Hey Jamie,There are lots of Piet models out there too, however, I wouldn't consider any ofthose useful for insight into building a piet. The design IS particularly wellsuited for duplicating in 1/3 or 1/4 scale, which would give you an idea ofhow one goes together.Years ago I saw a 1/4 scale model a ford on ebay... THAT would be cool!>From what I gather about your point of view, finding a partial complete is probablya good way for you to go. While ALL homebuilts have uniqueness, there area couple of aspects about the Piet which are more substantial than most otherdesigns. Primarily the engine, fuse length and gear. I'd highly recommendBrodhead or just finding some other venue with examples of these differencesso you can determine how close to the configuration you desire, the project wouldbe, which will help you determine it's worth to you.I'll dig around and see if I can find the contact info the Piet I referred to earlier.I'd have bought it, but timing was bad. I bought a flying Piet lastyear as well (hope to have it at brodhead) which was EXACTLY the configurationI wanted save the engine (though since I've decided it's definitely the engineI want, an A-65). I think it was a great way to go, my son (now 18yrs) andI are really having the time of our lives with the plane, and it's firmly cementingin my mind, the configuration of the plane I am building.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "K5YAC"
Congratulations Mike and Vic. I bet the feeling is almost indescribable! Rick SchreiberValparaiso INSent from my iPadOn Jul 12, 2012, at 5:38 PM, Michael Groah wrote:> > > Today we received our airworthiness certificate and my repairman's certificate for 414MV! It feels good to have that part done. Now I just need to do that final part..... fly it! The first flight should happen in the next couple of weeks. > > Mike Groah> Tulare CA> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Congratulations Mike and Vic. I bet the feeling is almost indescribable! Rick SchreiberValparaiso INSent from my iPadOn Jul 12, 2012, at 5:38 PM, Michael Groah wrote:> > > Today we received our airworthiness certificate and my repairman's certificate for 414MV! It feels good to have that part done. Now I just need to do that final part..... fly it! The first flight should happen in the next couple of weeks. > > Mike Groah> Tulare CA> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Original Posted By: "aussiegeorge"
>> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane>> anyway...>> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>>>>>> >>> > Sorry, Andrew, but that's absolutely hysterical!>> >>> > "Nothin's truly funny until someone gets hurt.">> >>> > Best to your lovely family.>> >>> > do not arcive>> >>> > -------->> > Kevin "Axel" Purtee>> > NX899KP>> > Austin/San Marcos, TX>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > Read this topic online here:>> >>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 556#377556>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>> ==========>> st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>> ==========>> http://forums.matronics.com>> ==========>> le, List Admin.>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>> ==========>>>>>>>>> *>> *>>________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
>> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane>> anyway...>> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>>>>>> >>> > Sorry, Andrew, but that's absolutely hysterical!>> >>> > "Nothin's truly funny until someone gets hurt.">> >>> > Best to your lovely family.>> >>> > do not arcive>> >>> > -------->> > Kevin "Axel" Purtee>> > NX899KP>> > Austin/San Marcos, TX>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > Read this topic online here:>> >>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 556#377556>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>> ==========>> st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>> ==========>> http://forums.matronics.com>> ==========>> le, List Admin.>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>> ==========>>>>>>>>> *>> *>>________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?