Original Posted By: "giacummo"
Rick,I am certainly no expert, but I had always been told to avoid using the gear fora step or welding a step onto a gear leg. Stress on the gear leg.Maybe someone with a lot more knowledge can chime in. Or you may be the one withmore experience, Rick, and I am just wrong.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: About wing tank
Pietenpol-List: About wing tank
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "tools"
Don Emch wrote:> You really don't want to grind or sand on bolts. Only creates a stress riserwhere you don't want it. Dunk the bolts in some lye or even just drain openerthen rinse them in some water. The cadmium plating comes right off.> > Don Emch> NX899DEWhat a GREAT tip Don, Thanks! Is this in Uncle Tony's book somewhere?--------Bob 'Early Builder' DewenterDayton OHRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Don Emch wrote:> You really don't want to grind or sand on bolts. Only creates a stress riserwhere you don't want it. Dunk the bolts in some lye or even just drain openerthen rinse them in some water. The cadmium plating comes right off.> > Don Emch> NX899DEWhat a GREAT tip Don, Thanks! Is this in Uncle Tony's book somewhere?--------Bob 'Early Builder' DewenterDayton OHRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "tools"
Mario,I think I understand what you are asking. Something to really consider is "normal". First, there's just a lot of factorson a plane this individualized to really know what "normal" is.Also, feeding from the rear... I think it's best to consider "worst case scenario".I really don't know of any situations where someone runs out of gas whenthey're taking off. It's usually when they've been flying too long, and arein the landing mode. At that point, you are rather nose down, slow and closeto the ground. If you're feeding from the rear, all the gas is AWAY from thepickup point, unless you have so much slope that would negate the advantagesof not making the low point in the middle (as in your case of going for maximumvolume).Without trim or flaps, a Piet flys a different angle of attack (and it's quitea bit of pitch change) for EVERY different speed. Something worth considering is keeping the standard shape wing tank and addinga header tank (which is what 2RN has). A header tank eliminates A LOT of thedanger of a large flatish bottom wing tank, which can easily slosh away a significantamount of fuel. It would even make a front or rear pickup point a lotsafer.2RN has a 4 gallon header tank, which is an hour of fuel nearly. It's nice toknow that if I plan on landing with an hour of fuel, there's no chance of a flameout because of an airplane attitude which causes a momentary loss of fuelfrom the wing tank.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Mario,I think I understand what you are asking. Something to really consider is "normal". First, there's just a lot of factorson a plane this individualized to really know what "normal" is.Also, feeding from the rear... I think it's best to consider "worst case scenario".I really don't know of any situations where someone runs out of gas whenthey're taking off. It's usually when they've been flying too long, and arein the landing mode. At that point, you are rather nose down, slow and closeto the ground. If you're feeding from the rear, all the gas is AWAY from thepickup point, unless you have so much slope that would negate the advantagesof not making the low point in the middle (as in your case of going for maximumvolume).Without trim or flaps, a Piet flys a different angle of attack (and it's quitea bit of pitch change) for EVERY different speed. Something worth considering is keeping the standard shape wing tank and addinga header tank (which is what 2RN has). A header tank eliminates A LOT of thedanger of a large flatish bottom wing tank, which can easily slosh away a significantamount of fuel. It would even make a front or rear pickup point a lotsafer.2RN has a 4 gallon header tank, which is an hour of fuel nearly. It's nice toknow that if I plan on landing with an hour of fuel, there's no chance of a flameout because of an airplane attitude which causes a momentary loss of fuelfrom the wing tank.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "giacummo"
Thanks Mike! Man, wish I'd have seen those pics BEFORE I started that repair,would have saved A LOT of headscratching and digging through a bunch of pilesof rubble trying to piece together exactly how everything was before. And I onlytook it apart last week (well, took the stab off months ago when I retrievedthe plane, dismantled the damaged area just last week)...Quick question, since you don't have lock nuts, what are you doing to prevent thosebolts from backing out? Of course, may not be a big deal since it's so easyto preflight.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Thanks Mike! Man, wish I'd have seen those pics BEFORE I started that repair,would have saved A LOT of headscratching and digging through a bunch of pilesof rubble trying to piece together exactly how everything was before. And I onlytook it apart last week (well, took the stab off months ago when I retrievedthe plane, dismantled the damaged area just last week)...Quick question, since you don't have lock nuts, what are you doing to prevent thosebolts from backing out? Of course, may not be a big deal since it's so easyto preflight.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By:
Mario,There's a third way to plumb the header tank, like mine is. You don't need tovent the header tank to the wing if you have a vent on the header tank (at it'sown level) that you can shut off. That way the wing tank will fill the headeruntil it is full (when fuel runs out the valve), then you close it. It's just like a big bubble in the fuel line on the way to the engine. Like anhour worth of fuel big bubble (it could easily be as small as a gallon I think).You just need to crack open that valve every so often to ensure the header tankis full. It WILL be unless you've drained the wing tank pretty empty or there'sa problem. Just put the valve somewhere convenient so it's easy to do ona preflight, not much different than sumping a tank.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 8:33:18 -0400
Mario,There's a third way to plumb the header tank, like mine is. You don't need tovent the header tank to the wing if you have a vent on the header tank (at it'sown level) that you can shut off. That way the wing tank will fill the headeruntil it is full (when fuel runs out the valve), then you close it. It's just like a big bubble in the fuel line on the way to the engine. Like anhour worth of fuel big bubble (it could easily be as small as a gallon I think).You just need to crack open that valve every so often to ensure the header tankis full. It WILL be unless you've drained the wing tank pretty empty or there'sa problem. Just put the valve somewhere convenient so it's easy to do ona preflight, not much different than sumping a tank.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 8:33:18 -0400
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "tools"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tankYes, my english vocabulary is short, and sometimes is difficult to writewhat i think.Thanks and regardsMario Giacummo2013/9/6 tools >> Mario,>> Also, I LIKE the drawing of your idea a lot. I didn't fully understand> the little dropped pickup point you did mention. If that were nearly a> gallon or two, it would really act like a header tank, especially if> baffled well.>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tankYes, my english vocabulary is short, and sometimes is difficult to writewhat i think.Thanks and regardsMario Giacummo2013/9/6 tools >> Mario,>> Also, I LIKE the drawing of your idea a lot. I didn't fully understand> the little dropped pickup point you did mention. If that were nearly a> gallon or two, it would really act like a header tank, especially if> baffled well.>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]"
Rest assured it wasn't your English Mario! You speak better English than I doANY language, English included!Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Rest assured it wasn't your English Mario! You speak better English than I doANY language, English included!Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
RE: Pietenpol-List: About wing tank
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Mario,Just some thoughts...The majority of Pietenpols only have one tank, either in the wing or in thefuselage...one fuel tank...one on/off valve. When the engine coughs at 500'because you have been distracted during your flying and mismanaged yourfuel, the last thing you need is to try to remember which valves need to beadjusted. If you have a flat-bottomed tank, the water will always be at thetrailing edge as the plane sits overnight, and during your pre-flight.Whether you choose to have other fuel lines in the other corners is up toyou, just make sure that, from the fuel tank exit point, you have apositive, downhill flow all the way to the gascolator, so that no water cancollect in any other part of the fuel system while sitting in the tail downposition. That way, at pre-flight, you can drain the fuel tank, and thegascolator, and know that you have removed all the water.Gary BootheNX308MB-----Original Message-----
Mario,Just some thoughts...The majority of Pietenpols only have one tank, either in the wing or in thefuselage...one fuel tank...one on/off valve. When the engine coughs at 500'because you have been distracted during your flying and mismanaged yourfuel, the last thing you need is to try to remember which valves need to beadjusted. If you have a flat-bottomed tank, the water will always be at thetrailing edge as the plane sits overnight, and during your pre-flight.Whether you choose to have other fuel lines in the other corners is up toyou, just make sure that, from the fuel tank exit point, you have apositive, downhill flow all the way to the gascolator, so that no water cancollect in any other part of the fuel system while sitting in the tail downposition. That way, at pre-flight, you can drain the fuel tank, and thegascolator, and know that you have removed all the water.Gary BootheNX308MB-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: About wing tank
Original Posted By:> owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: About wing tankUnderstand, hands on, lets begin with the tank. but.... welded orriveted?.. no, no.. it's a joke.regardsMario Giacummo2013/9/6 Gary Boothe >> Mario,>> Just some thoughts...>> The majority of Pietenpols only have one tank, either in the wing or in the> fuselage...one fuel tank...one on/off valve. When the engine coughs at 500'> because you have been distracted during your flying and mismanaged your> fuel, the last thing you need is to try to remember which valves need to be> adjusted. If you have a flat-bottomed tank, the water will always be at the> trailing edge as the plane sits overnight, and during your pre-flight.> Whether you choose to have other fuel lines in the other corners is up to> you, just make sure that, from the fuel tank exit point, you have a> positive, downhill flow all the way to the gascolator, so that no water can> collect in any other part of the fuel system while sitting in the tail down> position. That way, at pre-flight, you can drain the fuel tank, and the> gascolator, and know that you have removed all the water.>> Gary Boothe> NX308MB>>> -----Original Message-----
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: About wing tankUnderstand, hands on, lets begin with the tank. but.... welded orriveted?.. no, no.. it's a joke.regardsMario Giacummo2013/9/6 Gary Boothe >> Mario,>> Just some thoughts...>> The majority of Pietenpols only have one tank, either in the wing or in the> fuselage...one fuel tank...one on/off valve. When the engine coughs at 500'> because you have been distracted during your flying and mismanaged your> fuel, the last thing you need is to try to remember which valves need to be> adjusted. If you have a flat-bottomed tank, the water will always be at the> trailing edge as the plane sits overnight, and during your pre-flight.> Whether you choose to have other fuel lines in the other corners is up to> you, just make sure that, from the fuel tank exit point, you have a> positive, downhill flow all the way to the gascolator, so that no water can> collect in any other part of the fuel system while sitting in the tail down> position. That way, at pre-flight, you can drain the fuel tank, and the> gascolator, and know that you have removed all the water.>> Gary Boothe> NX308MB>>> -----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "giacummo"
You don't need a step if you have wire wheels. At least on my plane. I just havethe occasional passenger step on the tire. It is also a non slip surface.:)Oops, I just remembered that I also have a door... The tire may not work withouta door. What was I thinking?????????--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
You don't need a step if you have wire wheels. At least on my plane. I just havethe occasional passenger step on the tire. It is also a non slip surface.:)Oops, I just remembered that I also have a door... The tire may not work withouta door. What was I thinking?????????--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "tools"
Thanks for clearing that up, Bill.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Thanks for clearing that up, Bill.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "Douwe Blumberg"
I've also got a sight gage like that and love it as well. Any water that windsup in the wing tank is gonna show up there. Another feel good indication that'shands free.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
I've also got a sight gage like that and love it as well. Any water that windsup in the wing tank is gonna show up there. Another feel good indication that'shands free.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "tools"
Hey Chris,IF you can find a DAR in your area with a decent reputation, I'd seriouslyconsider spending the bucks just so you can get flying before winter.$.02Douwe________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Hey Chris,IF you can find a DAR in your area with a decent reputation, I'd seriouslyconsider spending the bucks just so you can get flying before winter.$.02Douwe________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
Original Posted By: "tools"
About the weight. Dick determined 2RN was gonna be a bit tail heavy, so that wasalso a consideration for a header tank, helped solve that problem. In theevent you do get into the header tank for fuel, it's a matter of I'd rather thanhave fuel than optimal balance... which makes sense. Also have a battery up there, just to keep the radio going for months and months...Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank
About the weight. Dick determined 2RN was gonna be a bit tail heavy, so that wasalso a consideration for a header tank, helped solve that problem. In theevent you do get into the header tank for fuel, it's a matter of I'd rather thanhave fuel than optimal balance... which makes sense. Also have a battery up there, just to keep the radio going for months and months...Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: About wing tank