Pietenpol-List: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: Gary Boothe
In my eyes, the Pietenpol is the most appealing and attractive homebuilt ever designed.But, looking on other forums, it has to out up with a lot of flack!Most of the comments are along the lines of "they are all underpowered", "it'sjust a single seater with a redundant extra seat" and "hardly anyone can fit intothe rear cockpit".I'm 6ft and 175lbs....fit nicely into all gliders and my current ship (ChallengerII). I know you never know until you try it on...but are other pilots of mysize seeing success? And what about with a pax of the same dimensions?I'm hoping these Piet Bashers are just trying to stir up trouble; and not refinedenough to see her true beauty --------Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

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Original Posted By: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?Jim,Are you asking leading questions on another forum? If you want a Piet, you need to swear off of such wasteful expenditures of time. Let the facts speak...I weigh 190 and have had a 200 lb passenger. Of course, that's with a powerful 100hp Corvair! https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O56GAtV3F ... X308MBSent from my iPad> On Apr 14, 2015, at 4:23 PM, BritishJim wrote:> m>> > In my eyes, the Pietenpol is the most appealing and attractive homebuilt ever designed. But, looking on other forums, it has to out up with a lot of flack!> > Most of the comments are along the lines of "they are all underpowered", "it's just a single seater with a redundant extra seat" and "hardly anyone can fit into the rear cockpit".> > I'm 6ft and 175lbs....fit nicely into all gliders and my current ship (Challenger II). I know you never know until you try it on...but are other pilots of my size seeing success? And what about with a pax of the same dimensions?> > I'm hoping these Piet Bashers are just trying to stir up trouble; and not refined enough to see her true beauty > > --------> Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 855#440855> > > > > > > ============================================================================================================================================> > > ________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: "BritishJim"
British Jim,Usually when you hear someone say a Piet is underpowered it means that the builder built it wayyyy too heavy. If built closely to the plansa Pietenpol will fly VERY nicely with a 40hp Model A Ford engine with a passenger (ask Dan Helsper who has given tons of rides in his Ford Piet.If you want a Cessan 172, then get a 172 but if you go into building and flying a Pietenpol you have to accept it for what it is----a 1930's homebuiltthat flies nicely if you don't build it heavy.At 6' and 175 pounds you are one of the lighter Piet pilot candidates out there and your plane will do good. I'm 210 and have a simple A-65 Continentalengine and have taken my brother who is around 220lbs for a ride.If you don't try to make the Pietenpol into something that it is not you'll get a great airplane and not have any unmet expectations.I took 4.5 years to build my plane and it has given me nearly 17 years of great service and much joy.Mike C.Ohio[cid:image001.jpg(at)01D076EC.296775B0]________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: "BritishJim"
Nice to meet you!I'm actually just a "lurker" on the other forums - not a registered user.Good to see you carrying a good load. Can I ask what power she is under?--------Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: "Jeff Boatright"
...and I can see you've already answered it. Need to get my eyes checked.--------Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: "Jeff Boatright"
Shoot, man, the most recent videos with Andy in the front pit and rear pit disproveall the nattering nabobs of negativity. Andy is a former college lineman,is a slim and trim 240(ish), and though he fills either cockpit, he is able topilot the Piet with aplomb and no problemo! Granted, climb out aint like withme (160 lbs) and half fuel, but we are well above the trees by the end of therunway.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSztlgt ... aTaABgRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Shoot, man, the most recent videos with Andy in the front pit and rear pit disproveall the nattering nabobs of negativity. Andy is a former college lineman,is a slim and trim 240(ish), and though he fills either cockpit, he is able topilot the Piet with aplomb and no problemo! Granted, climb out aint like withme (160 lbs) and half fuel, but we are well above the trees by the end of therunway. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSztlgt22l4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbwlmaTaABgRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2015 19:32:40 -0500Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Likewise, even though my A65 powered Pietenpol is 100 lbs heavier than MikeCuy's, I've taken passengers that weigh 205 and I weigh close to 200. Justdon't expect more than 200 fpm on the climb, but a Cub will do no betterwith such a load. Granted, unless I'm flying from a LOoong runway, I won'tcarry a passenger that weighs over 180, but that's because mine is 100 lbstoo heavy.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia

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Original Posted By: Ray Krause
BritishJim,I am still building so I don't have the flying stories of others, but here is mytake-If it is such a poor design, why is it still being built 86 years after it firstflew? Tell me other aircraft that hold that distinction. There are some, butnot in the same numbers as the Pietenpol.It is a poor design compared to what? and RV-10? a Wittman Tailwind? A Zenith?Different airplanes for different uses.How many of those critics have flown in a Pietenpol to even know what they aretalking about?My question is, are you trying to stir the pot? I guess I don't understand yourmotivation in creating the post. Go fly in one and I think that you won't worryabout what others think.And if you are looking for a 150 knot, IFR qualified, long distance trip aircraft,the the Pietenpol is probably not for you.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

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Original Posted By: Ray Krause
Gary Boothe just sent out a video of my taxiing his PIET to his new hangar. I'm6'4 and weigh 200 (unfortunately). His PIET was tight for me only because thefoot holes in the bulkhead are a little small for my size 14 shoes! But onceI got in, it was very comfortable and I had plenty of room. My SkyScout is designedfor my body with LOTS of leg and foot room. Others will certainly needpillows to fly it. My grandson is 6'6", 165 and he fits fine. Piets fit big boys!Thanks,Ray KrauseSent from my iPad> On Apr 14, 2015, at 4:58 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote:> > > Shoot, man, the most recent videos with Andy in the front pit and rear pit disproveall the nattering nabobs of negativity. Andy is a former college lineman,is a slim and trim 240(ish), and though he fills either cockpit, he is ableto pilot the Piet with aplomb and no problemo! Granted, climb out aint like withme (160 lbs) and half fuel, but we are well above the trees by the end ofthe runway.> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSztlgt22l4> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbwlmaTaABg> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 859#440859> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: "CatDesigns"
Gary Boothe just sent out a video of my taxiing his PIET to his new hangar. I'm6'4 and weigh 200 (unfortunately). His PIET was tight for me only because thefoot holes in the bulkhead are a little small for my size 14 shoes! But onceI got in, it was very comfortable and I had plenty of room. My SkyScout is designedfor my body with LOTS of leg and foot room. Others will certainly needpillows to fly it. My grandson is 6'6", 165 and he fits fine. Piets fit big boys!Thanks,Ray KrauseSent from my iPad> On Apr 14, 2015, at 4:58 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote:> > > Shoot, man, the most recent videos with Andy in the front pit and rear pit disproveall the nattering nabobs of negativity. Andy is a former college lineman,is a slim and trim 240(ish), and though he fills either cockpit, he is ableto pilot the Piet with aplomb and no problemo! Granted, climb out aint like withme (160 lbs) and half fuel, but we are well above the trees by the end ofthe runway.> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSztlgt22l4> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbwlmaTaABg> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 859#440859> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
JimI'm 6-1, 175. I have sat in the back seat of 4 Pietenpols (well 2Pietenpols and 2 GN-1s) and in the front seat of two of them. Leg wise itis a bit scrunched in the front but no worse than the J-3 I flew in. I haveno trouble getting into the front. The back seat has plenty of room for mylegs and the width is plenty wide for me. There is absolutely no issuegetting in the back seat.For reference this is me sitting in my plane. I do stick out a bit more thanthe less vertically gifted owners. My seat is as far down as I could makeit and I raised the rear headrest. http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%2 ... 87.JPGHere are some videos to prove that a Piet can fly with two people. Nooffence to Scott but I bet he is slightly denser than me. I believe Scotthas a C-85. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCKILEW ... Sacramento, CAWestcoastPiet.com-----Original Message-----

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Original Posted By: "tools"
Five ten, one eighty, took up a six something little, 210 pounder at brodhead,no problem. Lightweight all wood one piece wing, c-65.Not exactly your "don't worry we can make it" plane, but not horrible.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: Gary Boothe
Oh, and by the way....>From what I've learned over the last few years, the Piet is probably the worstflying machine I've been in... But the one that by a wide margin makes me smilethe most. I've flown a WIDE range of planes. To me a light twin is a 757.Build it with its genre in mind, fly it with it's genre in mind, you'll smile likethe rest of us when you fly!Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

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Original Posted By: "BritishJim"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?Steve,The end of this somewhat long video shows my 6' 2" son bailing out of my Piet: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O56GAtV3F ... X308MBSent from my iPad> On Apr 14, 2015, at 5:32 PM, Steven Dortch wrote:> > Who has the video of the 6ft 3 or 4inch guy making getting into the front cockpit look easy?> > My Son in law drives my old suburban and my old Toyota corolla with no problem and he is 6ft 4. So I want to give him a ride when the time comes.> > Blue Skies,> Steve D> > BTW I have lowered the weight of my plane with only the pilot on board by 20 pounds and improved the CG in the process. I lost 20 pounds on Alton Brown's Diet (from the TV show Good eats.) I found this diet easy to follow. I like all of the foods he pushes and it is not a fad diet, just good nutrition. My Piet's Registration says that it weighed 702 pounds when new. I will do a weight and balance before flight and let y'all know the outcome.> > Blue Skies,> Steve D> >> On Tue, Apr 14, 2015 at 7:00 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote:ry.edu>>> >> Shoot, man, the most recent videos with Andy in the front =98pit and rear =98pit disprove all the nattering nabobs of negativity. Andy is a former college lineman, is a slim and trim 240(ish), and though he fills either cockpit, he is able to pilot the Piet with aplomb and no problemo! Granted, climb out ain=99t like with me (160 lbs) and half fuel, but we are well above the trees by the end of the runway.>> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSztlgt22l4>> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbwlmaTaABg>> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here:>> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 860#440860>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ==========>> br> enpol-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>> ==========>> FORUMS ->> _blank">http://forums.matronics.com>> ==========>> b Site ->> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.>> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>> ==========> > > > -- > Blue Skies,> Steve D> > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D> ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: "AircamperN11MS"
All great information.I'm no pot stirrer! Just figured this place would provide better answers than abunch of forums where people were making judgments having never flown in one.Before diving into the build I just wanted my last few niggles ironed out, whichthey have been perfectly...with a super-hot iron.--------Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Jim,Chris is correct on both accounts. I do have a C-85 engine and I am a bunch moredense than he is. I am shamfully 5'10" and 230lbs. (the desk job came with30 extra pounds). I have had 250lb passengers. With that much weight I can onlytake ten gallons of fuel with me. My home airport sit at 2350 feet and wehave High density altitudes in the summers. The old saying has been that "if you can get in the Piet, It will fly you". Evenwith the Model A hanging on the front. If you ever find yourself in California look me up. You'll get a Piet ride outof it. Cheers,--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/1253 ... ______Date: Wed, 15 Apr 2015 08:44:56 -0500Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Are the "Piet Bashers" just stiring the pot?

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Original Posted By: "Barry Davis"
I just have a bunch more drag than I should. Oh, Jim, Build the plane light. Don't add any unnecessary weight. My plane weighedin at 600 lbs back in 1972. After I rebuilt it in the year 2000, it nowweighs 670lbs. Yes there is a noticeable difference in performance. My dads plan weighs 100lbs more than mine. He has an O-200 cont. engine and hisclimb performance is equal to mine. He also burns 1 gallon per hour more thenI do during our cross country flights together.Cheers,--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

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Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Please post more info about the forum at AirVenture as we get closer. I would like to attend if I can schedule between meetings.ThanksBarry DavisNX973BPEAA Board of Directors (and a Pietenpol Homebuilder)

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Original Posted By: Jim Markle
My dog would be the ideal passenger. He loves the wind in his face, he's easy toplease and he would only add 9lbs.....But I don't think he's still be there when we landed. Parachute and a GPS collarmay be my only option.--------Your nose is high; you're in the sky. The other way around; you'll hit the ground....Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2015 07:32:07 -0500 (GMT-05:00)

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Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Markle
I did not attach to the under camber...or any other part of the ribs, just letthe stitching pull it in; however, I'm recovering a Baby Ace where the formerowner did attach fabric to the ribs with Eco-Bond. It's a bit of a pain gettingthat old fabric off as, I'm not careful, it continually wants to pull wood withit. Just sayin'....Gary BootheNX308MB-----Original Message-----

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Original Posted By: Ken Bickers
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: How to attach the lower/undercamber fabric?

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Original Posted By: glenschweizer(at)yahoo.com
+ 3 for gluing not necessary. Poly fiber basically has you shrinking to 250, stitching,then final shrinking for under camber. This is what we did on the standardj-1, which is much more heavily under cambered and it worked great.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: How to attach the lower/undercamber fabric?

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Original Posted By:> owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Markle
Eco bond as in Home Depot Eco bond?Sent from my iPhone> On Apr 16, 2015, at 5:40 AM, "Gary Boothe" wrote:> > > I did not attach to the under camber...or any other part of the ribs, just letthe stitching pull it in; however, I'm recovering a Baby Ace where the formerowner did attach fabric to the ribs with Eco-Bond. It's a bit of a pain gettingthat old fabric off as, I'm not careful, it continually wants to pull woodwith it. Just sayin'....> > Gary Boothe> NX308MB> > -----Original Message-----

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Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: How to attach the lower/undercamber fabric?

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Original Posted By: Ben Charvet
Thanks VERY much for all the great/quick feedback! I can move forward now.Jim in Pryor.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

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Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
I used the Steward glue and attached the fabric to both the top and bottom withno antichafe. Just made sure the ribs were sanded smooth. As wide as the Pietenpolribs are the rib stitching is probably redundant, but it doesn't weigh muchand redundant is good aviation Sent from my iPhone> On Apr 16, 2015, at 1:32 PM, dfwplt wrote:> > > Thanks VERY much for all the great/quick feedback! I can move forward now.> > Jim in Pryor.> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 923#440923> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2015 16:51:31 -0500Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: How to attach the lower/undercamber fabric?

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Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: How to attach the lower/undercamber fabric?