Original Posted By: Gordon Brimhall
Just remembered that somewhere along the line I heard that anything thatthe FAA sees that looks yellow thru the varnish, they will fail. Causethey know its an " elmers glue".Now ,because there's no precover inspection, you could probably hide itin the wings. But people who fly know how quickly the state of mindchanges from the ground to the air. On the ground you talk flying, in the air the " pucker factor prevails"T88-T88-T88.......My Fisher flys great now ,and nothing flew off.waltPS If you actually fly, you'll know that there is so much to worryabout, without worrying about if the sticks are going to come apartJust remembered that somewhere along the line Iheard thatanything that the FAA sees that looks yellow thru the varnish, they willfail.Cause they know its an elmers glue.Now ,because there's no precover inspection, youcouldprobably hide it in the wings. But people who fly know how quicklythestate of mind changes from the ground to the air.On the ground you talk flying, in the air thepucker factor prevailsT88-T88-T88.......My Fisher flys great now ,andnothing flewoff.waltPS If you actually fly, you'll know that there is somuch toworry about, without worrying about if the sticks are going to comeapart________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: remember,,, there is no precover inspection
Pietenpol-List: Re: remember,,, there is no precover inspection
Original Posted By: "David B. Schober"
>> Just remembered that somewhere along the line I heard that anything that the> FAA sees that looks yellow thru the varnish, they will fail. Cause they know> its an " elmers glue".Walt/group- No matter what glue you use if would be wise to make up little'test pieces' of say capstip material, glue a few, date them with a marker, then save them for your FAA inspection. The inspector could very well askyou to break a few of those to show the wood breaks, not the glue joint.I saved many test pieces from various glue batches but the FAA guy neverasked.....at least this time. If you use flour and water and the wood breaksin your test before the glue, then the FAA has nothing to gripe about.Mike C. Just remembered that somewherealong the line I heard that anything that the FAA sees that looks yellowthru the varnish, they will fail. Cause they know its an elmersglue.Walt/group- No matter what glue you use if would be wise to makeup little'test pieces' of say capstip material, glue a few, date them with amarker, then save them for your FAA inspection. The inspector could verywell askyou to break a few of those to show the wood breaks, not the gluejoint.I saved many test pieces from various glue batches but the FAA guyneverasked.....at least this time. If you use flour and water and thewood breaksin your test before the glue, then the FAA has nothing to gripeabout.Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
>> Just remembered that somewhere along the line I heard that anything that the> FAA sees that looks yellow thru the varnish, they will fail. Cause they know> its an " elmers glue".Walt/group- No matter what glue you use if would be wise to make up little'test pieces' of say capstip material, glue a few, date them with a marker, then save them for your FAA inspection. The inspector could very well askyou to break a few of those to show the wood breaks, not the glue joint.I saved many test pieces from various glue batches but the FAA guy neverasked.....at least this time. If you use flour and water and the wood breaksin your test before the glue, then the FAA has nothing to gripe about.Mike C. Just remembered that somewherealong the line I heard that anything that the FAA sees that looks yellowthru the varnish, they will fail. Cause they know its an elmersglue.Walt/group- No matter what glue you use if would be wise to makeup little'test pieces' of say capstip material, glue a few, date them with amarker, then save them for your FAA inspection. The inspector could verywell askyou to break a few of those to show the wood breaks, not the gluejoint.I saved many test pieces from various glue batches but the FAA guyneverasked.....at least this time. If you use flour and water and thewood breaksin your test before the glue, then the FAA has nothing to gripeabout.Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re:
Original Posted By:> del magsam
Just a side note on the rudder bar thing.About 10 years ago I rebuilt the Super Cub that our glider club uses as atow plane. This is a PA-18A-150. The first half of it's life was as anaggie and it's been towing since. The airframe had about 10,000 hours whenwe rebuilt it and I used to fly barefoot. For about a year before therebuild, I had to wrap the rudder pedals with duct tape to keep fromcutting my feet since the tubing had warn thru. During the rebuild I putinternal sleeves in the rudder pedals. I can't imagine a Piet getting thekind of use that this Cub has seen and the airplane was built in '54. Idon't think I'd worry about the rudder bar!Howard Wilkinson wrote:> Del:> The Pietenpol rudder bar as simple as it is could be built from> anything of adequate strength. Chrome Moly is stronger than mild> steel, but more important than that is that 4130 may be had in> virtually any dimension and thickness.... Mild steel is not available> in very many thicknesses suitable for our purposes.> My opinion is that 6061 T6 aluminum could easily be substituted by> using a slightly larger diameter and thickness. In general aluminum> is said to be about 1/2 the strength of steel, but only 1/3 the> weight. This means that if you size the part to have a bit in excess> of 60% of the weight of the steel part you should be in pretty good> shape. I personally would put a nylon insert where the center bolt> goes through it, and probably at either end where the cables attach if> I were doing this... but then I'm a bit of a fanatic about bushings> and plugs.> I show it as being 3/4" .035 which weighs .2673 lbs per foot {.479> lbs for the part}. Looking at Aircraft Spruce catalog, I see that> 7/8" .058 wall 2024 (stronger than 6061) weighs in at .1777 lbs per> foot {.318 lbs for the part}, and the next size .065 weighs .1979 lbs> per foot {.3545 lbs for the part}. I would think that either of these> would probably be adequate....... This would yield a savings of 2 oz> or 2.5 oz roughly for the part.> **** Just my opinion ****> I assume most folks use some sort of wrapping or dip on this part> rather than bare metal ???? The 2.5 oz savings could allow for a> nice non slip coating
> How about a nice polished laminated wood piece there where> everybody can admire it If you are going all out for the Oshkosh grand> champion homebuilt award little details like that make all the> difference >> P.S. Ounces add up into pounds add up into TONS..... However care> should be exercised in material substitution as the strength and> fatigue properties of materials are different.>> -----Original Message-----
Just a side note on the rudder bar thing.About 10 years ago I rebuilt the Super Cub that our glider club uses as atow plane. This is a PA-18A-150. The first half of it's life was as anaggie and it's been towing since. The airframe had about 10,000 hours whenwe rebuilt it and I used to fly barefoot. For about a year before therebuild, I had to wrap the rudder pedals with duct tape to keep fromcutting my feet since the tubing had warn thru. During the rebuild I putinternal sleeves in the rudder pedals. I can't imagine a Piet getting thekind of use that this Cub has seen and the airplane was built in '54. Idon't think I'd worry about the rudder bar!Howard Wilkinson wrote:> Del:> The Pietenpol rudder bar as simple as it is could be built from> anything of adequate strength. Chrome Moly is stronger than mild> steel, but more important than that is that 4130 may be had in> virtually any dimension and thickness.... Mild steel is not available> in very many thicknesses suitable for our purposes.> My opinion is that 6061 T6 aluminum could easily be substituted by> using a slightly larger diameter and thickness. In general aluminum> is said to be about 1/2 the strength of steel, but only 1/3 the> weight. This means that if you size the part to have a bit in excess> of 60% of the weight of the steel part you should be in pretty good> shape. I personally would put a nylon insert where the center bolt> goes through it, and probably at either end where the cables attach if> I were doing this... but then I'm a bit of a fanatic about bushings> and plugs.> I show it as being 3/4" .035 which weighs .2673 lbs per foot {.479> lbs for the part}. Looking at Aircraft Spruce catalog, I see that> 7/8" .058 wall 2024 (stronger than 6061) weighs in at .1777 lbs per> foot {.318 lbs for the part}, and the next size .065 weighs .1979 lbs> per foot {.3545 lbs for the part}. I would think that either of these> would probably be adequate....... This would yield a savings of 2 oz> or 2.5 oz roughly for the part.> **** Just my opinion ****> I assume most folks use some sort of wrapping or dip on this part> rather than bare metal ???? The 2.5 oz savings could allow for a> nice non slip coating
> How about a nice polished laminated wood piece there where> everybody can admire it If you are going all out for the Oshkosh grand> champion homebuilt award little details like that make all the> difference >> P.S. Ounces add up into pounds add up into TONS..... However care> should be exercised in material substitution as the strength and> fatigue properties of materials are different.>> -----Original Message-----Original Posted By: william hutson
>> >I asked this one before but didnt get any answers> >yet. After I made my rudder bar out of steel rube, I> >noticed that It said to use chrome molley tube. does> >anybody know the reason for that? If it is because of> >the wear factor from your feet. could I just use some> >type of high wear sleeve. or is it a weight or> >strength issue.> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >--David B.Schober, CPEInstructor, Aviation MaintenanceFairmont State CollegeNational Aerospace Education Center1050 East Benedum Industrial DriveBridgeport, WV 26330-9503(304) 842-8300________________________________________________________________________________
>> >I asked this one before but didnt get any answers> >yet. After I made my rudder bar out of steel rube, I> >noticed that It said to use chrome molley tube. does> >anybody know the reason for that? If it is because of> >the wear factor from your feet. could I just use some> >type of high wear sleeve. or is it a weight or> >strength issue.> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >--David B.Schober, CPEInstructor, Aviation MaintenanceFairmont State CollegeNational Aerospace Education Center1050 East Benedum Industrial DriveBridgeport, WV 26330-9503(304) 842-8300________________________________________________________________________________