Original Posted By: Jim Markle
Hey Michael,They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you getthe newest O-200 (as has been stated).The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at aslower speed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a draggyairframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop,much faster for slicker airframes, and while it certainly will fly a Piet,just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both,not heresay).The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by JackTextor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a coupleO-200's he could modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself.You can contact me offline and I'll give you his email if you want to chatwith him.I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I couldleave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. Idid not want to stick the nose out there!I'll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. Oneside is finished, but I'll take shots while I put the other side together.Basically, it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from thecylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a24", 4" diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside itlooks like one piece, but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside andthe front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb, left side doescockpit heat (for my wife's toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keepthe shroud heat hot, and for a cool look.The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will runback a bit past the pilots' cockpit.Douwe________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2012 09:48:01 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
Hey Michael, They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you get the newest O-200 (as has been stated). The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at a slower speed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a draggy airframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop, much faster for slicker airframes, and while it certainly will fly a Piet, just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both, not heresay). The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack Textor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple O-200=92s he could modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself. You can contact me offline and I=92ll give you his email if you want to chat with him. I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I could leave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I did not want to stick the nose out there! I=92ll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One side is finished, but I=92ll take shots while I put the other side together. Basically, it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the cylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a 24=94, 4=94 diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside it looks like one piece, but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside and the front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb, left side does cockpit heat (for my wife=92s toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keep the shroud heat hot, and for a cool look. The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will run back a bit past the pilots=92 cockpit. Douwest" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ______Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2012 16:31:44 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Hey Michael, They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you get the newest O-200 (as has been stated). The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at a slower speed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a draggy airframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop, much faster for slicker airframes, and while it certainly will fly a Piet, just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both, not heresay). The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack Textor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple O-200=92s he could modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself. You can contact me offline and I=92ll give you his email if you want to chat with him. I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I could leave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I did not want to stick the nose out there! I=92ll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One side is finished, but I=92ll take shots while I put the other side together. Basically, it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the cylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a 24=94, 4=94 diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside it looks like one piece, but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside and the front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb, left side does cockpit heat (for my wife=92s toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keep the shroud heat hot, and for a cool look. The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will run back a bit past the pilots=92 cockpit. Douwest" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ______Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2012 16:31:44 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: "Douwe Blumberg"
Hey Michael,They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you get thenewest O-200 (as has been stated).The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at a slowerspeed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a draggy airframelike this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop, much fasterfor slicker airframes, and while it certainly will fly a Piet, just notas nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both, not heresay).The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack Textorand does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple O-200s hecould modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself. You can contactme offline and Ill give you his email if you want to chat with him.I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I could leaveon to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I did notwant to stick the nose out there!Ill try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One side isfinished, but Ill take shots while I put the other side together. Basically,it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the cylinders turn backand will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a 24, 4 diameter muffler justunder the cylinders. From the outside it looks like one piece, but the backis a muffler with some baffles inside and the front is a heat shroud. Rightside does the carb, left side does cockpit heat (for my wifes toes). Gonnawrap them in exhaust wrap to keep the shroud heat hot, and for a cool look.The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will run backa bit past the pilots cockpit.Douwest" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ntribution" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ributionst" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ntribution ________________________________________________________________________________
Hey Michael,They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you get thenewest O-200 (as has been stated).The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at a slowerspeed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a draggy airframelike this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop, much fasterfor slicker airframes, and while it certainly will fly a Piet, just notas nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both, not heresay).The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack Textorand does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple O-200s hecould modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself. You can contactme offline and Ill give you his email if you want to chat with him.I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I could leaveon to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I did notwant to stick the nose out there!Ill try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One side isfinished, but Ill take shots while I put the other side together. Basically,it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the cylinders turn backand will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a 24, 4 diameter muffler justunder the cylinders. From the outside it looks like one piece, but the backis a muffler with some baffles inside and the front is a heat shroud. Rightside does the carb, left side does cockpit heat (for my wifes toes). Gonnawrap them in exhaust wrap to keep the shroud heat hot, and for a cool look.The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will run backa bit past the pilots cockpit.Douwest" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ntribution" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ributionst" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ntribution ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: shad bell
Hey Michael, They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you get the newest O-200 (as has been stated). The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at a slower speed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a draggy airframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop, much faster for slicker airframes, and while it certainly will fly a Piet, just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both, not heresay). The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack Textor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple O-200=92s he could modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself. You can contact me offline and I=92ll give you his email if you want to chat with him. I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I could leave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I did not want to stick the nose out there! I=92ll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One side is finished, but I=92ll take shots while I put the other side together. Basically, it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the cylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a 24=94, 4=94 diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside it looks like one piece, but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside and the front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb, left side does cockpit heat (for my wife=92s toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keep the shroud heat hot, and for a cool look. The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will run back a bit past the pilots=92 cockpit. Douwest" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ______Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2013 23:22:29 -0800 (PST)
Hey Michael, They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you get the newest O-200 (as has been stated). The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at a slower speed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a draggy airframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop, much faster for slicker airframes, and while it certainly will fly a Piet, just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both, not heresay). The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack Textor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple O-200=92s he could modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself. You can contact me offline and I=92ll give you his email if you want to chat with him. I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I could leave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I did not want to stick the nose out there! I=92ll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One side is finished, but I=92ll take shots while I put the other side together. Basically, it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the cylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a 24=94, 4=94 diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside it looks like one piece, but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside and the front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb, left side does cockpit heat (for my wife=92s toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keep the shroud heat hot, and for a cool look. The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will run back a bit past the pilots=92 cockpit. Douwest" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ______Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2013 23:22:29 -0800 (PST)
RE: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: "C N Campbell"
Have had this mocked up for about a month=2C SE5 was also my inspiration=2C the book I read said pilots loved the long pipes. No muffler just a stainless flexible exhaust joint.Lyle________________________________________________________________________________
Have had this mocked up for about a month=2C SE5 was also my inspiration=2C the book I read said pilots loved the long pipes. No muffler just a stainless flexible exhaust joint.Lyle________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: Lyle Fast
How hot does that get and how far back does it get hot? If it gets hot TOO far back, I would surely scald myself. C ----- Original Message -----
How hot does that get and how far back does it get hot? If it gets hot TOO far back, I would surely scald myself. C ----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: rmueller23(at)gmail.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: C N Campbell
I expect it will get very hot! Caution is advised.
I expect it will get very hot! Caution is advised.
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: rmueller23(at)gmail.com
I expect it will get very hot! I figured it might melt the fabric glue. It also adds weight. I don't recommend it. But I love it and can't wait to hear it=2C I have never liked the sound or low/mid range performance of short headers on engines and the engine sound=2C low/mid range performance is a huge piece of the experience for me(I ride a harley). I am also a soloist so passenger considerations are low on my priorities.LyleDate: Sun=2C 15 Jan 2012 16:31:44 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
I expect it will get very hot! I figured it might melt the fabric glue. It also adds weight. I don't recommend it. But I love it and can't wait to hear it=2C I have never liked the sound or low/mid range performance of short headers on engines and the engine sound=2C low/mid range performance is a huge piece of the experience for me(I ride a harley). I am also a soloist so passenger considerations are low on my priorities.LyleDate: Sun=2C 15 Jan 2012 16:31:44 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Re: Pietenpol-List: Logo's
Original Posted By: Gary Boothe
Can I have one of the ones you don't want :>)? ----- Original Message -----
Can I have one of the ones you don't want :>)? ----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Logo's
Original Posted By: "Gary Boothe"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Logo'si didn't get anything to look atjohn________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Logo'si didn't get anything to look atjohn________________________________________________________________________________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Logo's
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Really? How about now?Gary BootheNX308MB
Really? How about now?Gary BootheNX308MB
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: Gerry Holland
Speaking of SE-5's, here's a replica that's still flying.It was made from plans available many years ago.Notice how tight the main tube is to the cylinders.It doesn't appear to have a muffler in there.I measured my landing gear today. It's 46 1/2"inside the ash blocks at the front. With the bungees,1/2" collar and brake bits there's another 5" on eachside, so 56 1/2" wheel center to center.Check out that narrow gear on that SE-5! And it'sbeen flying a long, long time like that. Hmmmmm....ClifAfter all has been said and done..... I just can't resist! :-)Never criticise a man until you've walked a mile in his shoes. Then, go ahead and criticise. After all, you're a mile a way and you've got his shoes. Have had this mocked up for about a month, SE5 was also my inspiration, the book I read said pilots loved the long pipes. No muffler just a stainless flexible exhaust joint. Lyle________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Speaking of SE-5's, here's a replica that's still flying.It was made from plans available many years ago.Notice how tight the main tube is to the cylinders.It doesn't appear to have a muffler in there.I measured my landing gear today. It's 46 1/2"inside the ash blocks at the front. With the bungees,1/2" collar and brake bits there's another 5" on eachside, so 56 1/2" wheel center to center.Check out that narrow gear on that SE-5! And it'sbeen flying a long, long time like that. Hmmmmm....ClifAfter all has been said and done..... I just can't resist! :-)Never criticise a man until you've walked a mile in his shoes. Then, go ahead and criticise. After all, you're a mile a way and you've got his shoes. Have had this mocked up for about a month, SE5 was also my inspiration, the book I read said pilots loved the long pipes. No muffler just a stainless flexible exhaust joint. Lyle________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: Gerry Holland
Cliff Hi from England.Please find attached 2 photos of an SE5A replica (7/8 Scale) here in West of England.This probably has most of what you want to confirm your feelings for long exhaust etc.This one is powered by a C90 and has an 80 inch plus Prop made by Alan James, the Mr Pietenpol of UK.The engine area is made up to look authentic using dummy spark plugs and manifold and traditional radiator nose area.It sounds great. I will edit a video clip and upload to You Tube later and send a URL for you to take a look.A Pietenpol would look good with some of this. Mind you I like the Ford A setup flying behind a radiator!RegardsGerryGerry Hollandgholland@content-stream.co.uk+44 (0)7808 402404White Ox Mead Airstrip, Bath. England________________________________________________________________________________
Cliff Hi from England.Please find attached 2 photos of an SE5A replica (7/8 Scale) here in West of England.This probably has most of what you want to confirm your feelings for long exhaust etc.This one is powered by a C90 and has an 80 inch plus Prop made by Alan James, the Mr Pietenpol of UK.The engine area is made up to look authentic using dummy spark plugs and manifold and traditional radiator nose area.It sounds great. I will edit a video clip and upload to You Tube later and send a URL for you to take a look.A Pietenpol would look good with some of this. Mind you I like the Ford A setup flying behind a radiator!RegardsGerryGerry Hollandgholland@content-stream.co.uk+44 (0)7808 402404White Ox Mead Airstrip, Bath. England________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: Jim Markle
CliffA You Tube video of the earlier mentioned SE5A replica for sound effect!Go for it. I can get more information on the set up if you need it. Perhaps youshouldn't be encouraged!!Gerryhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9B7L3q14Mw____ ... ______Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2012 06:42:35 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
CliffA You Tube video of the earlier mentioned SE5A replica for sound effect!Go for it. I can get more information on the set up if you need it. Perhaps youshouldn't be encouraged!!Gerryhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9B7L3q14Mw____ ... ______Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2012 06:42:35 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
Pietenpol-List: Re: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB"
Not my thread but thanks for the pics, etc. Very cool!Lyle--------My passion for the landscape has lead me to the sky.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Not my thread but thanks for the pics, etc. Very cool!Lyle--------My passion for the landscape has lead me to the sky.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: Lyle Fast
Hi Gerry from EnglandI think it's Lyle who needs the pics. He's got the longexhaust. I found an interesting pic of the real thing.What this does to the exhaust note I don't know butit must be something. Otherwise, why go to all thistrouble? Real good lookin' replica!Clif in British Columbia.ALMOST around the world.
Cliff Hi from England. Please find attached 2 photos of an SE5A replica (7/8 Scale) here in West of England. This probably has most of what you want to confirm your feelings for long exhaust etc. ! Regards Gerry________________________________________________________________________________
Hi Gerry from EnglandI think it's Lyle who needs the pics. He's got the longexhaust. I found an interesting pic of the real thing.What this does to the exhaust note I don't know butit must be something. Otherwise, why go to all thistrouble? Real good lookin' replica!Clif in British Columbia.ALMOST around the world.
Cliff Hi from England. Please find attached 2 photos of an SE5A replica (7/8 Scale) here in West of England. This probably has most of what you want to confirm your feelings for long exhaust etc. ! Regards Gerry________________________________________________________________________________RE: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: "Gboothe5"
Clif=2C That is an amazing photo=2C just incredible. I am just up here in Sayward=2C B.C.Lyle________________________________________________________________________________
Clif=2C That is an amazing photo=2C just incredible. I am just up here in Sayward=2C B.C.Lyle________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: TOM MICHELLE BRANT
Gee, you're only 5 1/2 hrs away from me here inthe infamous Kitsilano! :-)Where you going to fly out of?Clif Clif, That is an amazing photo, just incredible. I am just up here in Sayward, B.C. Lyle ________________________________________________________________________________
Gee, you're only 5 1/2 hrs away from me here inthe infamous Kitsilano! :-)Where you going to fly out of?Clif Clif, That is an amazing photo, just incredible. I am just up here in Sayward, B.C. Lyle ________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: carlson aircraft aluminum struts
Original Posted By: helspersew(at)aol.com
Anyone using the Carlson Aircraft Aluminum struts? I'm taking a look at them pretty seriously.. Thinking the large size is adequate - they have what they're calling a "NEW" Heavy Duty size which seems overkill for a Piet. Anyone using them - anyone flying with them??? I think I read about Larry Williams using them. Just curious which size he chose and what the fittings might look like. Of course I can always check out his plane at Brodhead - assuming he'll be there again.Tom Brant ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: carlson aircraft aluminum struts
Anyone using the Carlson Aircraft Aluminum struts? I'm taking a look at them pretty seriously.. Thinking the large size is adequate - they have what they're calling a "NEW" Heavy Duty size which seems overkill for a Piet. Anyone using them - anyone flying with them??? I think I read about Larry Williams using them. Just curious which size he chose and what the fittings might look like. Of course I can always check out his plane at Brodhead - assuming he'll be there again.Tom Brant ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: carlson aircraft aluminum struts
Original Posted By: TOM MICHELLE BRANT
Hi Tom,I copied Larry Williams (Top or Head Curmudgeon) and used the small Carlson wing struts. Go to westcoastpiet.com, where there are three photos to look at. The inserts were made from 7075 aluminum alloy pieces I got from Mcmaster-Carr. Dan HelsperPuryear, TN-----Original Message-----
Hi Tom,I copied Larry Williams (Top or Head Curmudgeon) and used the small Carlson wing struts. Go to westcoastpiet.com, where there are three photos to look at. The inserts were made from 7075 aluminum alloy pieces I got from Mcmaster-Carr. Dan HelsperPuryear, TN-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: carlson aircraft aluminum struts
Original Posted By: Greg Bacon
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: carlson aircraft aluminum struts
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: carlson aircraft aluminum struts
Re: Pietenpol-List: do you guys doubt your work somtimes?
Original Posted By: Andrew Eldredge
Hi I'm working on the tail section.(just need to make the fin and than its done)I'm building very neat, exactly following the plans.But when I think that these parts are gone steer my hole plane they look a bit flimsy.And will i ever finish there is just so much to do.I love the work so far but did these thoughts come up when you guys where building.Matthijs from the Netherlands.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2012 09:29:30 -0700Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: do you guys doubt your work somtimes?
Hi I'm working on the tail section.(just need to make the fin and than its done)I'm building very neat, exactly following the plans.But when I think that these parts are gone steer my hole plane they look a bit flimsy.And will i ever finish there is just so much to do.I love the work so far but did these thoughts come up when you guys where building.Matthijs from the Netherlands.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2012 09:29:30 -0700Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: do you guys doubt your work somtimes?
RE: Pietenpol-List: do you guys doubt your work somtimes?
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Hi Matthijs,I'm sure everybody has doubts at one point or another. Just remember,particularly with the tail pieces, that they ARE very flimsy until they areinstalled and braced with the bracing wire. Even then, they are just strongenough for flight loads. Be wary of small children using them as climbingexercises. Trust the design - it has proven itself to be plenty strongenough for over 80 years.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----
Hi Matthijs,I'm sure everybody has doubts at one point or another. Just remember,particularly with the tail pieces, that they ARE very flimsy until they areinstalled and braced with the bracing wire. Even then, they are just strongenough for flight loads. Be wary of small children using them as climbingexercises. Trust the design - it has proven itself to be plenty strongenough for over 80 years.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: do you guys doubt your work somtimes?
Original Posted By: Ben Charvet
Those thoughts can cripple you into not ever getting done... it has me for about18 years. It's especially tough because of the mixed information. I specifically chose aPiet because it's like the Spanish language, very few exceptions. "Just stickto the plans" seems to be the norm, and they are comparatively VERY complete.Still, when you ask a question, you very often get quite a variance in answers.I'm currently rereading the first ten years of BPA newsletters, and in the FIRSTONE, it says to stick to the plans... except...It's a necessary evil, times have changed since it was designed. 4130 over 1020steel, probably a good idea. T-88 or resorcinol instead of casein, definitely!Etc.I believe the trick is to find a "method" that gets you past that. Either trustingwhat you hear here, a local knowledgeable builder, an A and P friend, whatever.What has done it for me is buying an entire Piet, which has finally gottenme started on building in earnest. Also, I'm spending a lot of time withA and P's restoring and maintaining vintage planes. I believe the worst you could do is blindly "improving". Many issues come fromwhat is NECESSARY for modernization. Casein glue being a good case in point.Hard wires are a good example. While they're still fine, finding wire isn'ttoo bad, but finding some help in fabricating them, a different matter, so modernizingfor that reason might be necessary.Not for a lack of trying to gather good info, I have hand written letters fromRudolf, Henderson, Kapler, Hoopman, etc, I don't have the Bingelis books yet.I think they go a long way putting your mind at ease on what is "normal" in aircraftconstruction. Working on that now. I believe comprehensive educationis the best that you can do to put your mind at ease!ToolsRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2012 13:16:07 -0500
Those thoughts can cripple you into not ever getting done... it has me for about18 years. It's especially tough because of the mixed information. I specifically chose aPiet because it's like the Spanish language, very few exceptions. "Just stickto the plans" seems to be the norm, and they are comparatively VERY complete.Still, when you ask a question, you very often get quite a variance in answers.I'm currently rereading the first ten years of BPA newsletters, and in the FIRSTONE, it says to stick to the plans... except...It's a necessary evil, times have changed since it was designed. 4130 over 1020steel, probably a good idea. T-88 or resorcinol instead of casein, definitely!Etc.I believe the trick is to find a "method" that gets you past that. Either trustingwhat you hear here, a local knowledgeable builder, an A and P friend, whatever.What has done it for me is buying an entire Piet, which has finally gottenme started on building in earnest. Also, I'm spending a lot of time withA and P's restoring and maintaining vintage planes. I believe the worst you could do is blindly "improving". Many issues come fromwhat is NECESSARY for modernization. Casein glue being a good case in point.Hard wires are a good example. While they're still fine, finding wire isn'ttoo bad, but finding some help in fabricating them, a different matter, so modernizingfor that reason might be necessary.Not for a lack of trying to gather good info, I have hand written letters fromRudolf, Henderson, Kapler, Hoopman, etc, I don't have the Bingelis books yet.I think they go a long way putting your mind at ease on what is "normal" in aircraftconstruction. Working on that now. I believe comprehensive educationis the best that you can do to put your mind at ease!ToolsRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2012 13:16:07 -0500
> Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: Lyle Fast
>> Hey Michael,>>> They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you get> the newest O-200 (as has been stated).>>> The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at> a slower speed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a> draggy airframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much> smaller prop, much faster for slicker airframes, and while it certainly> will fly a Piet, just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who> have flown in both, not heresay).>>> The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack> Textor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple> O-200=92s he could modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work> yourself. You can contact me offline and I=92ll give you his email if you> want to chat with him.>>> I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I could> leave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I> did not want to stick the nose out there!>>> I=92ll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One> side is finished, but I=92ll take shots while I put the other side together.> Basically, it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the> cylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a> 24=94, 4=94 diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside it> looks like one piece, but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside> and the front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb, left side does> cockpit heat (for my wife=92s toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keep> the shroud heat hot, and for a cool look.>>> The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will> run back a bit past the pilots=92 cockpit.>>> Douwe>> *>> st" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List> ttp://forums.matronics.com> =_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution> *>> *>===========>=================================>> *>>________________________________________________________________________________
>> Hey Michael,>>> They weigh the same, as they are basically the same engine, unless you get> the newest O-200 (as has been stated).>>> The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at> a slower speed, allowing for a larger prop, which performs better on a> draggy airframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much> smaller prop, much faster for slicker airframes, and while it certainly> will fly a Piet, just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who> have flown in both, not heresay).>>> The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack> Textor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple> O-200=92s he could modify, but not sure if you wanted to do the work> yourself. You can contact me offline and I=92ll give you his email if you> want to chat with him.>>> I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on, a everything I could> leave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I> did not want to stick the nose out there!>>> I=92ll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One> side is finished, but I=92ll take shots while I put the other side together.> Basically, it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the> cylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a> 24=94, 4=94 diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside it> looks like one piece, but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside> and the front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb, left side does> cockpit heat (for my wife=92s toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keep> the shroud heat hot, and for a cool look.>>> The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will> run back a bit past the pilots=92 cockpit.>>> Douwe>> *>> st" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List> ttp://forums.matronics.com> =_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution> *>> *>===========>=================================>> *>>________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: O-200-C-90 and exhaust/heat muffs
Original Posted By: "C N Campbell"
Hey Michael=2CThey weigh the same=2C as they are basically the same engine=2C unless you get the newest O-200 (as has been stated).The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at a slower speed=2C allowing for a larger prop=2C which performs better on a draggy airframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop=2C much faster for slicker airframes=2C and while it certainly will fly a Piet=2C just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both=2C not heresay).The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack Textor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple O-200=92s he could modify=2C but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself. You can contact me offline and I=92ll give you his email if you want to chat with him.I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on=2C a everything I could leave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I did not want to stick the nose out there!I=92ll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One side is finished=2C but I=92ll take shots while I put the other side together. Basically=2C it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the cylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a 24=94=2C 4=94 diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside it looks like one piece=2C but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside and the front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb=2C left side does cockpit heat (for my wife=92s toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keep the shroud heat hot=2C and for a cool look.The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will run back a bit past the pilots=92 cockpit.Douwest" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ntribution" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ntribution ________________________________________________________________________________
Hey Michael=2CThey weigh the same=2C as they are basically the same engine=2C unless you get the newest O-200 (as has been stated).The benefit of the C-90 over the O-200 is that it produces more torque at a slower speed=2C allowing for a larger prop=2C which performs better on a draggy airframe like this one. The O-200 was designed to spin a much smaller prop=2C much faster for slicker airframes=2C and while it certainly will fly a Piet=2C just not as nicely as a larger prop (this from guys who have flown in both=2C not heresay).The guy who built my engine up is a great guy who was recommended by Jack Textor and does great work. He has all the parts for a C-90 and a couple O-200=92s he could modify=2C but not sure if you wanted to do the work yourself. You can contact me offline and I=92ll give you his email if you want to chat with him.I wanted the weight up front so left the starter on=2C a everything I could leave on to approximate the weight of the Ford which balanced perfectly. I did not want to stick the nose out there!I=92ll try to post some pics of the exhaust/muffler/heat muff set up. One side is finished=2C but I=92ll take shots while I put the other side together. Basically=2C it looks like a WWI SE5 exhaust. Two downtubes from the cylinders turn back and will run back alongside the fuselage. There is a 24=94=2C 4=94 diameter muffler just under the cylinders. From the outside it looks like one piece=2C but the back is a muffler with some baffles inside and the front is a heat shroud. Right side does the carb=2C left side does cockpit heat (for my wife=92s toes). Gonna wrap them in exhaust wrap to keep the shroud heat hot=2C and for a cool look.The side pipes will run joint these units through a ball joint and will run back a bit past the pilots=92 cockpit.Douwest" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ntribution" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... ntribution ________________________________________________________________________________